Where to purchase crate motors?

[Trim'd Up]

There is a set of 496's in the OSO classifieds for a decent price with low hours. They look like maybe innovation motors or something.
http://www.offshoreonly.com/classifieds/496_420_complete_engines-o30754-en.html

 

[scarabman]

There is a set of 496's in the OSO classifieds for a decent price with low hours. They look like maybe innovation motors or something.
http://www.offshoreonly.com/classifieds/496_420_complete_engines-o30754-en.html

No such luck there. They are Volvo-ized 496s. No worries though, it is all GM based stuff.

Innovation only did the 500s and 600s for Volvo. Those motors were/are based on a package that had been put together for Fountain. After Fountain gave up the package, due to drive issues, Volvo stepped in and picked up right where they left off.

 

[MikeyFIN]

I agree a true marine engine is better than a crate engine. However, a lot of people have had good luck with using crate motors in their boats with a few minor changes.

Now whats a true marine engine?

One with brass plugs and a mild almost no overlap cam with a big LSA because of the wet exhaust.
The LongBlocks are 1:1 to their car blocks and come from the same foundry line.

 

[Chris]

Componentry and clearances are big issues. Auto engines spend 95% of their lives below 2500 rpm and at less than 1/3rd output power. High perf marine engines typically spend the majority of thier time at more than twice that.

 

[Geronimo36]

Now whats a true marine engine?

One with brass plugs and a mild almost no overlap cam with a big LSA because of the wet exhaust.
The LongBlocks are 1:1 to their car blocks and come from the same foundry line.

marine engines are "looser" for lack of a better term...more like enduro engines..... a little more piston to wall and healthier ring gaps, even bearing clearance can be higher, they're not all equal. in terms of parts such as the block, yeah, same stuff...

I've seen many a car engine blow up in boats

 

[Sunsation96]

I will keep on the search the details on this boat are still coming in as we speak but if the price is right I need to be ready to jump, so wanted to be armed with a price in mind. But like Chris has stated this is only good if the price is more than fair. This could take more money than thought, but I need to figure out what the owner is leaving and keeping off the boat and what is there. The boat also has less than 50 hours on it! Which is a plus for me that is as close to new as I will get anytime soon. More details to follow when more is worked out. Stay tuned...

 

[fund razor]

You're probably going to find that your best bet is to pick up a bargain on a used, together and functioning boat. Unless you put new merc in the boat whatever you put in is going to be worth less the second you bolt it in.

And you have to assume something is wrong in the drives- you have no way of determining otherwise.

Based on alot of experiences with alot of projects, unless this is a special boat that you just have to have, or unless you're literally stealing it, you're going to put more money into it than you think. Maybe way more. And if this is your first trip to the rodeo on a project boat, assume not only more $$ but more time.

There's some great value to be found in being able to operate and have surveyed your prospective purchase before laying down your cash.

I should have talked to you before I bought my boat.

 

[Tony]

Those generalisations are almost always total crap.
A car engine done as a marine engine is in short averything you bolt on it has to be marine stuff i.e. all the accessories.
The engine block itself in a bread and butter marine engine can be a regular 4-bolt even cast crank truck engine with only brass plugs instead of steel ones.

In fact the 454 SS pickups had brass plugs in their blocks and the intake carried the same serial number ( and the camshaft too) than the 330/454...

Mikey, I posted that link so he could get a grasp on the electrical/fuel management safety aspects of auto vs. marine. I dont want to see a thread posted on one of theese sites about how some guy blew himself and a handfull of freidns up by dropping a turnkey ZZ motor in his boat becacse he didnt know any better.

 

[Chris]

There's an example of a "gotta have" boat.

 

[Tony]

I will keep on the search the details on this boat are still coming in as we speak but if the price is right I need to be ready to jump, so wanted to be armed with a price in mind. But like Chris has stated this is only good if the price is more than fair. This could take more money than thought, but I need to figure out what the owner is leaving and keeping off the boat and what is there. The boat also has less than 50 hours on it! Which is a plus for me that is as close to new as I will get anytime soon. More details to follow when more is worked out. Stay tuned...

Heres the best calculator:

Are you getting a soild hull? If yes then continue.

Are you gettting it for basically free? if yes then buy it.

If no to either of thee above then keep looking.

 

[Sunsation96]

Heres the best calculator:

Are you getting a soild hull? If yes then continue.

Are you gettting it for basically free? if yes then buy it.

If no to either of thee above then keep looking.

Thanks for the calculator Tony!:rofl: My wife would love that #2
I should know the price by the end of the week and more details:26:

 

[fund razor]

Is the 32 Sunsation something that you want to end up with? Because if you will be keeping it as opposed to just moving through it... that would make a difference too.

 

[Expensive Date]

Merc also made a limited run of 400 hp small blocks... come complete with headers! http://sites.mercurymarine.com/portal/page?_pageid=33,69423&_dad=portal&_schema=PORTAL

In all seriousness, I think a boat that size and weight you'll be a lot happier with the extra torque of the big block. Small blocks do have their place though, 30 ft and under, I'm just not so sure your application is the best.

The places I listed above should be able to get you decent deals on turn-key packages.

Could I use my existing MPI setup on my 6.2s with those engines by just swapping the manifolds.

 

[Tony]

Thanks for the calculator Tony!:rofl: My wife would love that #2
I should know the price by the end of the week and more details:26:

I bought a Cigarette using that calculator and I'm still kicking myself in the nads. Fundy will see the light some day too.

 

[ROGUE]

I had some really good luck with a Jasper engine back in the 90's in my 18' Sutphen. It was a Mopar 340. That thing is still running!!!!:ack2::ack2:


.... it shouldn't be!!!!:sifone: I ran the snot out of it for the 8-10 years before I sold the boat. Look 'em up, they have a marine division and warrenties!

Im sure some people have had good luck with them. Theres a bar right next to the plant in Jasper Indiana. Stop by and talk to the employees about buying a performance marine engine from them. After the laughing stops, buy them all a drink, thank them, and go on down the road.

 

[ROGUE]

When I bought my Formula311, I basically paid for the engines, the boat, trailer etc. was free. I was lucky to be able to sell it for what I paid for it after 2 years. There was a 311 repo near me last year for sale for 6k no power no drives. The only thing that would have made sense on that deal is if they gave me 6K to take it away. By the time I put drives and engines in it, I would have more in it than buying a decent fully equiped boat.

 

[HaxbySpeed]

I dont want to see a thread posted on one of theese sites about how some guy blew himself and a handfull of freidns up by dropping a turnkey ZZ motor in his boat becacse he didnt know any better.

The ZZ4 is actually a great marine engine and even has its own class in Whitewater marathon jet boats where it's common to run 90-100% throttle for two to three hours at a time.. :leaving:

You can try these guys too.. They'll even bargain a bit.. :sifone:

http://www.marinepowerservice.com/B...392/parent_cat2/450396/parent_cat3/450417.cfm

 

[fund razor]

I bought a Cigarette using that calculator and I'm still kicking myself in the nads. Fundy will see the light some day too.

Someday???

No no no.

This is not a reasonable and logical thing that I am doing with that Apache. It is not a business decision. I just decided that I could have never bought one new, and willl never find a new one again. It was the most solid, heavy, and longest running surface that I could find in a 28 foot package, which was a long as I wanted to go because of my transport and storage situation. Plus, I wanted to tow the crap out of it and drop it in all over. A 28 cig would have only worked for me as a sit-down conversion. I wanted a stand up. So... when I am done after 2 years and a lot of money, I will have a "new" 1988 apache brave... from the bottom up. Besides... you know that lake. Heavy is good. Light is bad. I had the chance to buy a sweet 311 formula for a little less than I will have in my brave. I decided that I didn't want just another 311 formula. When my boat is done... there will be a market for it... no matter how many formulas, bajas and exaggerated length fountains are on the market.

And the last point.... you know the impact of showing up with a sweet older boat that has been restored. The people walk past all the new stuff to see your timeless masterpiece.

The question for our Sunsation fan is whether he wants to take the time and money to make a 32 exactly what he wants it to be. If he does... it is worth it. If he just wants a bigger boat. It is not.

Btw... I just want to say thank you for saving a classic offshore. Your boat looked awesome in the pics. Congrats.

 

[Geronimo36]

Could I use my existing MPI setup on my 6.2s with those engines by just swapping the manifolds.

Even though that's a 6.3L engine, it's really a stroked 5.7L small block. Do you have the 6.2L Horizon's?

 

[Sunsation96]

I wish there was a rule of thumb blue book if you will pricing on a boat with out power. I the fact is that I love Sunsation boats, the service I get is second to none they treat me like family and are there when I need them. I also love your boats as well but at this time point in my life and at my age I feel very fortunate to be moving up to a 32'. Also the storage at my rack building only goes to 32' and going from a 24'/25' Sunsation this will be a huge upgrade for my wife and I. I know the rule of thumb go as big as you can and this is for me. I boat on Lake St. Clair and this will be perfect once a year I trailer to large water and if the 25' could handle that the 32' will also. I am still getting the details on this boat as we speak if it comes with drives, it is fully loaded boat k-planes full IMS steering extension boxes you name it! But as I said I need to hear a price on what the "dream" price will be. But thanks for all you help I needed the power of SOS to find out engine prices and you have helped me. I have found a pair of 467's from a very trusted engine builder that I know and is awesome at engines, need to find out the price on the engines. I know they will be more than fair, he also treats me like family. I will keep you guy's in the loop.