The Great Unification

[Sean Stinson]

Jimmy

I was trying to make it to Clearwater today but I have some issues to deal with so time wasn't a luxury that I had today but I am very disappointed that I couldn't get there!!!

 

[Sean Stinson]

Build it and they will come!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[MOBILEMERCMAN]

Maybe the real question is how do you get the top classes to agree?

V extreme, Super boat V, Super V limited, P1, Superboat 525,,,,, Now I hear the 850 doesn't fit in a class too many inches. They all have #6's and should be running together.

Pick an engine guys. Spec or power to weight or a combo of both. What ever ,,,Just do it.

 

[shifter]

Mike,

Too many classes.

90/120/above.

Prize $ for top 3 in each class.

Color designation (red /white / blue) for class under the numbers for the "fans/TV"

The big boats have to be there because most pleasure boats are able to blow away 90% of the "raceboats" out there.

pat W:driving:

 

[MOBILEMERCMAN]

The big boats have to be there because most pleasure boats are able to blow away 90% of the "raceboats" out there.

pat W:driving:

:boxing_smiley: Slight exaggeration.

 

[imco offshore]

Mike,

Too many classes.

90/120/above.

Prize $ for top 3 in each class.

Color designation (red /white / blue) for class under the numbers for the "fans/TV"

The big boats have to be there because most pleasure boats are able to blow away 90% of the "raceboats" out there.

pat W:driving:

that not so ,,, i,v said this before, pleasure boaters run wide open for three seconds, slapp each other on the a$$ and talk about how bad they are???? tell them to come out under race conditions water is what it is and run 100 miles as fast as the guy in front of them, and all of a sudden their balls are gone, and ( the excusess ) my boat wasn, built for that, ect,,,, i hate it when someone says my bass boat can go that fast,, yea go get it ,, ya never see them again, pleasure boaters CRUISE for a long time and their now offshore racers,,,,,,

 

[Rik]

Here is what they are going to be using in Powerboat P1 for the 2010 season on all the boats.

This is a torque meter that goes between your engine and the drive unit. (How they would couple to a close couple Bravo I do not know) The pic's are showing it installed upon the Apache pace boat in P1 which obviously has transmissions.

They are going to mandate that every boat use these (don't know if they have to be on one engine both as the rules only require one engine to be sealed in P1 (LOOP HOLE)) to monitor the power the engines are actually producing and then adjust weight accordingly.

This is not new technology. It is nothing but a strain gauge with a sensor that reads the engines rpm and thus the math to hp is found. I remember these about 10 yrs ago at the Ft. Lauderdale boat show in the Michigan Propellers booth (they were the distributor) but now they are going to find their way into a race boat for parity classes in Europe.

 

[MOBILEMERCMAN]

I have heard about that. Can it transmit information? Or does it have to be retrieved?

 

[imco offshore]

Here is what they are going to be using in Powerboat P1 for the 2010 season on all the boats.

This is a torque meter that goes between your engine and the drive unit. (How they would couple to a close couple Bravo I do not know) The pic's are showing it installed upon the Apache pace boat in P1 which obviously has transmissions.

They are going to mandate that every boat use these (don't know if they have to be on one engine both as the rules only require one engine to be sealed in P1 (LOOP HOLE)) to monitor the power the engines are actually producing and then adjust weight accordingly.

This is not new technology. It is nothing but a strain gauge with a sensor that reads the engines rpm and thus the math to hp is found. I remember these about 10 yrs ago at the Ft. Lauderdale boat show in the Michigan Propellers booth (they were the distributor) but now they are going to find their way into a race boat for parity classes in Europe.

rik could it be put on the propeller shaft on bravos? that would help a large group of racers in speck and p classes now.?

 

[Rik]

I have heard about that. Can it transmit information? Or does it have to be retrieved?

With P1, BOTH. They know how fast, how many rpm and how much fuel you are using LIVE during the race. It is amazing that they have really turned to technology to try and even out the crying from the racers.:rofl:

The technical guy in P1 was formely with the FIA and took the technology from Formula 1.

With the live feedback they have, they can plug this in to the system and transmit it back to the pits during the race.

 

[MOBILEMERCMAN]

It doesn't look like it George. It is about 4 inches long and doubt it wants to be submerged.

I also heard it is used in F1 cars as part of the shifting system.

 

[MOBILEMERCMAN]

With P1, BOTH. They know how fast, how many rpm and how much fuel you are using LIVE during the race. It is amazing that they have really turned to technology to try and even out the crying from the racers.:rofl:

The technical guy in P1 was formely with the FIA and took the technology from Formula 1.

With the live feedback they have, they can plug this in to the system and transmit it back to the pits during the race.

Sounds like the perfect devise.

 

[Rik]

rik could it be put on the propeller shaft on bravos? that would help a large group of racers in speck and p classes now.?

They will require some space. This is why (in P1 all boats are twin engine and 99% of them are stagger) I think that only one engine will be able to accept this. On the Bravo boats, (Only 1 this year full time and one wild card in P1) the forward engine can use this. Same for my drives as my rear engine location does not have room to accommodate this. But I think for cost wise each boat would only have to use one.

Now being that all SVL's run a standoff box (correct) maybe these can be put in the standoff box area? Come to think of it, a strain gauge is nothing more than a small little thin strip of material. This can be put onto the current shaft that runs into your standoff box and some sort of connection between the gauge and the shaft can be developed and then read.

This is exactly what they had 10 yrs ago as a kit to put on existing drive lines in cruisers.

 

[imco offshore]

now this could change racing as we know it ( for the good) and make a tech mans job easier, rik,,,, couldn,t u put one on your shaft, i would love to see what my boat would do with an arneson,, dooooo,,,,,

 

[Rik]

They do not have to be placed upon the actual propeller shaft itself, rather the drive line can be used as the device to measure the torque.

 

[shifter]

The comment about Big Boats was "superboats,extreme,whatever they are called now, not the pleasure boats,they (superboats,extreme,whatever) are the SHOW.

The pleasure boaters "poker runners" are not racers but they go to races and are fans. They might get involved if they think they can win. They are not impressed with 525 boats.

My point is simplify the sport.

pat W

 

[MOBILEMERCMAN]

Yes, it is a SHOW so is WWF wrestling but, it is supposed to be a racing competition.

 

[Pete B]

a fleet of DNF doesnt impress people much either

 

[shifter]

Ahh yes the C word.

Competition is a contest between individuals, groups, nations, animals, etc. for territory, a niche, or allocation of resources. It arises whenever two or more parties strive for a goal which cannot be shared. Competition occurs naturally between living organisms which co-exist in the same environment. For example, animals compete over water supplies, food, and mates, etc. Humans compete for water, food, and mates, though when these needs are met deep rivalries often arise over the pursuit of wealth, prestige, and fame. Business is often associated with competition as most companies are in competition with at least one other firm over the same group of customers.

Competition may give incentives for self-improvement. For example, if two watchmakers are competing for business, they will hopefully improve their products and service to increase sales. If one watchmaker is more responsive to the needs of consumers, this watchmaker will flourish. If birds compete for a limited water supply during a drought, the more suited birds will survive to reproduce and improve the population.

Rivals will often refer to their competitors as "the competition". The term can also be used to refer to the contest or tournament itself.


Competition

It has not existed in boat racing for years so now that the merc show is over lets get back to some healthy competition. May the best manufacturer win.

pat W :USA:

 

[1waterboy1]

The comment about Big Boats was "superboats,extreme,whatever they are called now, not the pleasure boats,they (superboats,extreme,whatever) are the SHOW.

The pleasure boaters "poker runners" are not racers but they go to races and are fans. They might get involved if they think they can win. They are not impressed with 525 boats.

My point is simplify the sport.

pat W

A "show" is not competitive racing.If a show is what the fans and sponsors want,offshore powerboat racing already would have made it. The trend in most forms of motorsports from local stock car racing right up to NASCAR and FORMULA 1 are competition based rules focused on improving the actual racing through limiting technology and costs to compete.This ultimately allows more competitors and parity.This is what the NASCAR Car of Tommorow program is all about.The NASCAR Sprint Cup cars are racing at speeds that are much slower today than they were twenty five years ago.

We need many equally matched boats and teams racing in a very limited number of classes.The fans would rather watch alot of boats racing each other at slower speeds than a few boats putting on a show at very high speeds.Plus,the Super,Xtreme and Unlimited type class boats seem to have trouble finishing.

I think the APBA LLC had the right idea with the initial rules for Super Cat;and there is no doubt that it was the most competive racing big boat class racing in the history of the sport.There was quantity and quality throughout the Super Cat field.

I do agree that the rules should be set up to allow any hull,engine,drive manfacturers to participate.Instead of a Mercury spec engine and drive for a particular class,have built to spec engine and drive rules.