:iagree: with the guy who has seen it happen before.
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Let's talk SVL's!!! 2010 is coming fast!
- Thread starter imco offshore
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:iagree: with the guy who has seen it happen before.
MANITIE
Charter Member / Competitor
And something to consider...which Im sure you have already....
With the owners of the boats having say in the rules...and most of the SVL teams now are of the older boats...what will be the limitations on the new and faster hulls....
Will the newer hulls have to remain origanl and have to stay the same for a time period say 3 to 5 years...
Will the older boat be allowed to continue to make chages to stay compeditive...
Your class has opened the eyes of new manufactures....I just hate to see them have the door closed on them because of tech moving foward..
Thanks again...
With the owners of the boats having say in the rules...and most of the SVL teams now are of the older boats...what will be the limitations on the new and faster hulls....
Will the newer hulls have to remain origanl and have to stay the same for a time period say 3 to 5 years...
Will the older boat be allowed to continue to make chages to stay compeditive...
Your class has opened the eyes of new manufactures....I just hate to see them have the door closed on them because of tech moving foward..
Thanks again...
Guy's dont reject it, embrace it. How long do we think our old 15 year boats should be the only thing allowed to race in SVL. WE NEED MORE NEW BOATS!!! There is no differace in someone playing with the bottoms of there boats from the origanal mold or a manufactur building a proto type SVL modifying it to profection and then popping a mold off there fine tuned version. And I dont want to here its a one off hull that hasent been sold to the public beacause then you just have eliminated all the small manufact. like this new guy that wants to build his first SVL.
How important is winning to most of us? That should be the question we all need to ask ourselves. If someone wants to spend 300K on a SVL than have at it. I will still race the best I can with the other 15 year old boats and have some great racing.
The trick is keep everyone happy even if they dont win on that given day and to come out of the water and say, I had a great race with the boat next to me and we were racing for last place in a field of 15. Thats how you keep people interested. The best race of the day was the Pirates and Octain batteling it out lap after lap. I talked to both teams after the race and all they kept saying was what a great battle they had. They didnt say that sucked we got beat bad buy the other boats. Screaming nuts walked away with a check for $2500 and didnt even start the race. Do you think he was glad we worked as a class?
Take the money aspect out of it and split it equaly between each team that shows up and then it doesnt matter what place you come in or how expensive the compations boat is. Give the top 3 teams trophys. Dont encourage teams to feel they need to spend 100K in R&D have a shot at getting a bigger purse. Keep it about having fun and racing the boat thats closest to you. There is no return on your money if we do it this way.
For those of you that missed the SVL race we paid out $12,500 in purse money on the spot with a OSS check.
Mike A. with all due respect you have no skin in this game and you had your chance with the LLC. You have made your predictions well known. Please let the class grow in our own direction.
As far as rules go the SVL class is running under the OSS rule book at this point. If you have hull questions please call Mike Tomlinson from OSS for clairification. In the future SVL as a class can disscuss rule changes in the future.
MD
How important is winning to most of us? That should be the question we all need to ask ourselves. If someone wants to spend 300K on a SVL than have at it. I will still race the best I can with the other 15 year old boats and have some great racing.
The trick is keep everyone happy even if they dont win on that given day and to come out of the water and say, I had a great race with the boat next to me and we were racing for last place in a field of 15. Thats how you keep people interested. The best race of the day was the Pirates and Octain batteling it out lap after lap. I talked to both teams after the race and all they kept saying was what a great battle they had. They didnt say that sucked we got beat bad buy the other boats. Screaming nuts walked away with a check for $2500 and didnt even start the race. Do you think he was glad we worked as a class?
Take the money aspect out of it and split it equaly between each team that shows up and then it doesnt matter what place you come in or how expensive the compations boat is. Give the top 3 teams trophys. Dont encourage teams to feel they need to spend 100K in R&D have a shot at getting a bigger purse. Keep it about having fun and racing the boat thats closest to you. There is no return on your money if we do it this way.
For those of you that missed the SVL race we paid out $12,500 in purse money on the spot with a OSS check.
Mike A. with all due respect you have no skin in this game and you had your chance with the LLC. You have made your predictions well known. Please let the class grow in our own direction.
As far as rules go the SVL class is running under the OSS rule book at this point. If you have hull questions please call Mike Tomlinson from OSS for clairification. In the future SVL as a class can disscuss rule changes in the future.
MD
Steve Miklos
Charter Member / Competitor
Randy
This has never lead to more boats before. To me this is simple. if I really need to show the business case with about 20 years worth of actual examples I will. Before I exert that effort please someone put in writing how this brings more boats at the events.
Steve
MANITIE
Charter Member / Competitor
Just trying to see whats the best way to go....This class shows the most promise in growning along with Class 5...
But what's the rules for next year...
I agree if new hulls come out they will be more efficent then the old one...
Thats why I was woundering if there will be a rule put in for example: the new SVL Fountain that all other SVL Fountains must be built the same as this one...not the next will have changes and each one after that be continuing the same making even 1 year old boat out dated...
Has this been address that anymore SVL Fountains have the same hull and cannot make any mondifactions....
With O/L and a couple of other Manufactures looking to get into the game...what wil be done differantly so the passed dose not rear its ugly head again....
F1 and F2 was one of the best classes....but one reason was the hymoligation rule in effect...and no one offs built...and no changes to the hull....
This worked and was woundering will this be applied to SVL...and mybe grandfather the older Extremes, Phantoms and Activators tio make some hull changes to keep up to new tech.
But you guys are spending a lot of money on these older boats to make them faster....
But will next year be a true P1 Class...power to weight ratio....or only 525's allowed....Ilmor wants to get into the game...will this even be looked at....
We know SVL will be run 2010 under OSS rules and thats good the season has started but if you want new boats for next year....teams need to start now....
The SVL guys are busy racing this year....but there is a oppertunity for 5 to 8 mores teams to join in next..if the rules are posted now....
Now That's Funny:iagree:
MANITIE
Charter Member / Competitor
I've come a long way in the last 7 year....at least give me that...:cheers2:
Steve Miklos
Charter Member / Competitor
Scott
As the king of BS talk and comments etc. This is a strange comment coming from you.
What P1 thinks or does is immaterial at this time. You need boats attending actual events regularly for anything of any substance to solidify.
For what George is try to accomplish 7-10 boats works.
For what P1 appears to want to accomplish you need 20-25 boats.
If we knew P1's business plan/rules/technical staff/marketing plan and revenue stops, we could begin to speculate about what they like or dislike.
If you think the existing SVL owners are going to buy new boats you are mistaken. Perhaps two may under the right circumstances.
If you think new racers are going to come and shell out $250K to build a specific use single engine boat to race whenever/wherever you are mistaken also.
Concerning P1.
The 2000 lb elephant in the room is P1's track record does not make fiscally responsible people want to spend their cash.
Steve
Spoken like a true genuis. Randy, you helped screw things up for everyone years ago and you are still at it. You have no idea what it takes to grow a class or an organization so you will excuse me if I just laugh at you and ignore your advice. If you do not want to listen to me then just ignore me - even though I personally developed the SVL class. My advice is free and was never meant for you anyway as I put you in the same class as Chastelet, Mauf, Teague, Whittier, etc. You know, the other genuises who have done so much to ruin racing since 2003. Once again you are trying to lead good people over the cliff. So my advice to everyone interested in seeing SVL succeed long term is stay away from Mike Tomlinson. OSS is dead. P1 never was and never will be. And Randy is not the brightest bulb in the chandelier. Call George, Jr.
There is no P1. It is a figment of a few lingering imaginations. A few bucks in escrow and Martin's lengthy pressers are meaningless.
DAREDEVIL
Banned
Steve Miklos
Charter Member / Competitor
While I have created, developed and built many classes starting with F1 and F2 and ending with spec. engine SVL and SVL I have never destroyed one.
This discussion should be for the equipment owners.
Steve
I have no idea what Martin's deal is with P1. What I do know is that the P1 v-bottom business in Europe flamed out and there is no viable business plan or real money behind P1 in the States. George, Jr. got the SVL class fired up for this year. P1/Martin did nothing but grab onto his coattails, make guys wear car racing uniforms, write some lengthy, flowery press releases that actually said nothing, and offer up some pennies, relatively speaking, for a handful of races.
Throw in Mike Tomlinson and his crayon rules, an all but dead OSS, behind the scenes efforts to push George out of the way, and the typical division of interests and teams, and you get what you always get...crud. That is why I keep yelling to George and the inexperienced racers, to stick together. Write a solid set of rules. Use the LLC's 2003 rules as a guide, and go run with OPA and if he will agree to abide your rules, SBI.
Ignore those with a track record of wrecking things.
earthwerks
New member
Some of you guys in SVL just do not understand what P1 USA is trying to do. Let me try to explain this as simply as i can. P1 USA is trying to take a class of boats and make them marketable to potential event and team sponsors. To do this they need a group of boats with significant #'s and owners willing to commit to races. the whole idea is that the series as a whole has the value, and it really does not matter to any one but you guys who wins or looses. You WINGNUTTS are already fracturing you group based on small technicalities, and big egos. AT this point there is fare less value in winning a race, then putting on a race, the value is where the action is. By the time there is any more value in winning, then just racing, the playing field will equal itself. Go ahead and make a train wreck out of this, and another class will be happy to take your place.
Dunbar 104
Charter Member / Competitor
As you may notice half of these questions and comments are not from actual svl owners. I understand totally what P1 USA is trying to accomplish and I am for any growth in class numbers. I am eager to see what follows with next year and how things will play out. As for right now I would just like to see as many svl's come out and race and have a good time. I'm pretty sure we all like competition and that's why we are in this class. I always want to win but after the race is over and I didn't, I know that I gave it my best and ran as best as I could. We are trying to do what is best for the class this year to keep the numbers up, not what is best for one individual. Next year all of the svl owners will vote and do what we all think is best for the class whether it be P1 USA or what ever else there could be.
Jenni - svl owner
I get tired of listening to the bickering, act like men not girls.
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