Copenhagen

Global warming, climate change= Complete Bullchit!!!!!!!!:rolleyes::sifone:

That's it! I'm going to stab myself in the eye with a fork for burning all of that fuel this year!!:willy_nilly::willy_nilly::ack2::sifone::sifone::cheers2:

There´s a link but how much does it have to change to really effect ?`
And who are the ones who should be worried..well if you look at how close the sealevel almost every U.S. coastal town is built Yes I´d be worried.
Thenagain that´s not only a U.S. worry either...
Plus when we have Tsunamis that can whipe a 1/4 million people in a day they put priorities into perspective also...

On my behalf and where I live no I have no problem with some warming..seems our temp is 10 degrees right now, hell haven´t been this cold this early for almost a decade.

But regarding fuel use Craig, just use your car less or get an econobox ( if you ain´t got already) to commute and save it for the summer (read boat) ;)
 
I like how they show a picture of a glacier breaking off and falling into the sea and say - SEE the glaciers are melting.

Glaciers don't break off when they are melting. They only break off because they are growing.
 
The north pole IS getting smaller.......but why is the south pole getting LARGER!!!!


seems that little fact gets swept under the rug since it dis-spells the theory of global warming. And besides, we've had several ice ages, and then "global warming" that brought us out of those ice ages......since all of those cycles happened before humans, isn't this the normal cycle of earth???
 
Man made climate change is a myth, period. And as for my Finnish friend, the US has always been on the forefront of actual emissions reduction and our cars have always been cleaner sooner than any of the Euro pigs. I can remember them bringing in Grey Market BMW's from your German buddies because they could not pass US emissions, so please, spare me. And please name the fine automobiles the Finns have made lately? :confused::confused: The whole ACC scam is a transfer of cash from those that have it (us) to those that don't have as much (corrupt Third World sh!tholes). With a nice chunk cut off the top for dipchits like ALgore (manbearpig) and the Dicktaters of the aforementioned sh!tholes. Nevermind the fact that studies have shown that a few degrees of warming would actually enhance the longevity and quality of life for MILLIONS of people all over the world. As a boater I say- "Bring it on!" and screw the 'warmies" .:mad:
 
The other thing that needs to be brought to the front is the fact that because US companies are the cleanest manufacturers in the world, most of the manufacturing jobs have left.

Adding additional requirements to US business, that no other country has to meet, not only puts a penalty on the US, but adds to the overall global emissions of pollutants because the items still need to be built, they just get built in some schithole where no pollution standards have to be met. Currently 84% of ALL the rivers in China would be posted as unfit for human contact in the US. Not to mention the air quality.

Another similar farce pulled on us by our government was methanol. We subsidized the farmers to grow it, subsidized the plants to produce it, paid a penalty on the price of cars to run with it, ruined many engines using it. And the actual bottom line..... It causes more carbon emmisions to go through the process of growing and refining it for use than just burning gas in the first place. Plus, the increase in price caused by being subsidized, drove up the costs of almost every food product in the world......:cuss:
 
Man made climate change is a myth, period. And as for my Finnish friend, the US has always been on the forefront of actual emissions reduction and our cars have always been cleaner sooner than any of the Euro pigs. I can remember them bringing in Grey Market BMW's from your German buddies because they could not pass US emissions, so please, spare me. And please name the fine automobiles the Finns have made lately? :confused::confused: The whole ACC scam is a transfer of cash from those that have it (us) to those that don't have as much (corrupt Third World sh!tholes). With a nice chunk cut off the top for dipchits like ALgore (manbearpig) and the Dicktaters of the aforementioned sh!tholes. Nevermind the fact that studies have shown that a few degrees of warming would actually enhance the longevity and quality of life for MILLIONS of people all over the world. As a boater I say- "Bring it on!" and screw the 'warmies" .:mad:

The man made climate change is not a myth but how much will affect is a ?

The Key words in your text are HAS BEEN, unfortunately you lost it somewhere.
Porsches. All the Speedsters are made here.

Thenagain cars ain´t our Forté.. Trucks are and (Cruise) Ships and (Sail)boats, Nautor´s Swan, Baltic Yachts and so on..

Regarding EPA and the Gray market... just politics... just like the ban on importing powerboats from there to here nowadays.

ACC it´s just not Your money that the 3rd world needs it´s also ours. So why aren´t we complaining, because we don´t invest there in the 3rd world that much, we like to keep the Jobs Right HERE and produce the products they need, not go there if possible.

Why is it that it takes 3 times more CO2 gases to produce the same Watt overthere as it does overhere?
Makes you rethink doesn´t it?
 
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The other thing that needs to be brought to the front is the fact that because US companies are the cleanest manufacturers in the world, most of the manufacturing jobs have left.

Adding additional requirements to US business, that no other country has to meet, not only puts a penalty on the US, but adds to the overall global emissions of pollutants because the items still need to be built, they just get built in some schithole where no pollution standards have to be met. Currently 84% of ALL the rivers in China would be posted as unfit for human contact in the US. Not to mention the air quality.

Cleanest manufacturers since when?

Another similar farce pulled on us by our government was methanol. We subsidized the farmers to grow it, subsidized the plants to produce it, paid a penalty on the price of cars to run with it, ruined many engines using it. And the actual bottom line..... It causes more carbon emmisions to go through the process of growing and refining it for use than just burning gas in the first place. Plus, the increase in price caused by being subsidized, drove up the costs of almost every food product in the world......:cuss:

Well we have to use methanol here yearly and probably a lot of gas companies in NA have filtrated methanol in the Gas since day one so why now the sudden engine problems ?
Why aren´t we facing any?

Regarding the price of it all..it´s the Judgement day right here no need to be so negative. look at the possibilities within the emission industry and create US jobs.

And some info about China...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kyoto_Protocol#United_States


As of August 27, 2008 China surpassed the United States as the biggest emitter in the world of CO2 from power generation, according to the Center for Global Development.[46] On a per capita basis, however, the emission by the power sector in the U.S. is still nearly four times that in China. The top ten power sector emitters in the world in absolute terms are China, the United States, India, Russia, Germany, Japan, the United Kingdom, Australia, South Africa, and South Korea. If the 27 member states of the European Union are counted as a single country, the E.U. would rank as the third biggest CO2 polluter, after China and the United States. In per capita terms, emissions from the U.S. power sector are the second highest in the world. The production of electricity in the U.S. produces about 9.5 tons of CO2 per person per year, compared to 2.4 tons per person per year in China, 0.6 in India, and 0.1 in Brazil. The average per capita emission from electricity and heat production in the E.U. is 3.3 tons per year. Only Australia, at greater than 10 tons per year, emits more power-related emissions per person than the U.S does.
In a related report, Canadian economists Jeff Rubin and Benjamin Tal issued a report dated March 27, 2008, The Carbon Tariff[47] Relying on data from a variety of sources, including the U.S. Energy Information Administration, Rubin and Tal ground their proposal for a carbon tariff in striking facts, including the following:
China’s GHG emissions have increased by 120% since the beginning of the decade, while U.S. emissions have increased 16% over the same period;
China now exceeds the United States as the single largest GHG emitter, and accounts for more than a fifth of global GHG emissions;
China relies more heavily on coal-fired power plants, the most GHG-intensive energy source, than do most OECD countries. Between now and 2012, the increase in Chinese coal-based emissions will exceed the entire level of coal-based emissions in the United States.
In June 2007, China unveiled a 62-page climate change plan and promised to put climate change at the center of its energy policy and insisted that developed countries had an “unshirkable responsibility” to take the lead on cutting greenhouse gas emissions and that the principle of "common but differentiated responsibility", as agreed up in the UNFCCC, should be applied.[48][49]
China stated the criticisms of its energy policy were unjust.[50] It is unfair to compare among different countries, since China alone makes up one-fifth of the world's population and the per capita emission in China was low compared to the emission in the industrialized world. Even after one combines the population of the E.U., the U.S., Canada, Australia, New Zealand, Japan, and South Korea, China would still outnumber them by a few hundred million. A comparison of yearly emissions also neglects the cumulative amount generated by developed countries. Studies of carbon leakage also suggest that nearly a quarter of China's emissions result from production of goods exported to developed countries.[51]
 
The largest offense back then was perpetrated by those whom polluted the rivers and fields with bodies.
:(

That would be father sunshine...and who aligned with that lunatic?


“ I just have a hunch that Stalin is not that kind of a man. . . . I think that if I give him everything I possibly can and ask for nothing from him in return, noblesse oblige, he won't try to annex anything and will work with me for a world of democracy and peace. ”
—Franklin D. Roosevelt, 1943

Assumption is the mother of all...and the key words: If I Give him EVERYTHING. i.e. total world domination that is what Russians are after, always have always will.

The WW2 History lesson has ended, go home and do your homework.
 
about 15 years ago the EPA came to see us cause a fired employee reported we were pouring printing inks down the drain. My father carried the guy in the back, grabbed a brand new 5 lbs can of ink and opened it. He then held out the guys hand and turned the ink can upside down over the guys hand and nothing came out. This stuff is WAY thicker than maple syrup......no way in hell we could get it down the drain if we tried!!!


The guy agreed this was a frivolous report but since he was here he'd check us out. Our company was the first to install silver recovery units in our drain systems even though it was legal to dump the amount we discharged, we had seperate dumpster for pallets and paper to go to recycling centers even though most competitors sent all that crap to the landfills......we weren't worried, we're outdoorsmen and care about the environment......the guy ended up spending weeks in our plant!!!!!

Nearly 12 months later we were hit with a $535,000 "fine" for a huge list of violations! :eek: We ended up hiring a defense lawyer that specializes in EPA matters. 2 years later she was able to show they were fining us for things that weren't illegal, that weren't legal anymore but were when we were checked (and we had since changed to comply with new laws), or had mis-represented the data when in fact we were in compliance. Finally they were stuck on this last item that was BS and they wanted $5,000 for it. She advised we could fight it too, but just pay the $5K and let them walk away thinking they at least got something......2 years and $40,000 to the lawyer later we were done.

I already do the right thing, and I'm not a fan of the EPA.

Current issues:
They worry about the "fumes" in my building. It's perfectly legal for me to open all the doors and windows in my plant for ventilation.....If I put a fan in the window I have to get a permit for it or will (and have been) fined for it.

I have to report how many lbs of printing ink EVAPORATE out of my building every year......how do you calculate that!!! If I go over a pre-determined amount I have bought PERMITS for I get fined cause I didn't buy a large enough permit!

They want to check what fluids get dumped down my drains yet I have a permit for everything but water that is bought and stored in my building. They started testing the discharge water at the next manhole down the street to see what I may have dumped....quarterly!! I contested that they could be capturing crap from someone else further up the street. They're solution, Install a manhole access on my property before our discharge hits the main line so they can test us there instead...$20,000 for that...and had to get permits from 2 offices to tap into the discharge line!!!
5 years+ testing and they haven't found a thing (which BTW they send me the bill for the tests to be completed)

last month I get a bill for a new "fee" I've never heard of before. "rain water run-off fee" of nearly $4,000. Is this a joke, what is it. Turns out the local/state "EPA" office (actually the city GOV) needs cash so they've created a new bill for the amount of roof space you have that keeps rain water from seeping into the ground! I was told to expect this every year from now on.

Whoa..with the property taxes I´ve found and the fact that the taxes for my wage is higher in the U.S. Than here plus the pay is 40% less I gotta rethink about relocating, I can live with 8 bucks a gallon for gas right here.

Hard to believe EPA is that stupid to you or in general..all the info is available but thenagain when you became a target...
Why do they have to have a single manhole for you..why not go to every house on the neighborhood or check your waterlocks??? It can all be analyzed right there..IF EPA can´t bring on the C.S.I.s :)

We got the same fees for rainwater..the rain waters ( grey water in general ) aren´t allowed to go in the main lines without a fee anymore so people are allowed to let the rain pipes to go in the soil.
And My father was the first one in our city doing that to all his properties, 2 years before needed and saved a lot of money as didn´t have to fight for plumbers... normal awareness.
 
"last month I get a bill for a new "fee" I've never heard of before. "rain water run-off fee" of nearly $4,000. Is this a joke, what is it. Turns out the local/state "EPA" office (actually the city GOV) needs cash so they've created a new bill for the amount of roof space you have that keeps rain water from seeping into the ground! I was told to expect this every year from now on. "


Holllleeee shiiiiiiiiit! Now that is a heapin spoonful of b.s.
 
"last month I get a bill for a new "fee" I've never heard of before. "rain water run-off fee" of nearly $4,000. Is this a joke, what is it. Turns out the local/state "EPA" office (actually the city GOV) needs cash so they've created a new bill for the amount of roof space you have that keeps rain water from seeping into the ground! I was told to expect this every year from now on. "


Holllleeee shiiiiiiiiit! Now that is a heapin spoonful of b.s.

Actually the fee is from using the sewers for rain ( grey) water right?
I guess it´s not illegal to let the water from the roofs still drain in the ground ?

The pay for that is hysterical though.
 
The man made climate change is not a myth but how much will affect is a ?


MYTH http://www.theresilientearth.com/?q=content/medieval-warm-period-rediscovered

The Key words in your text are HAS BEEN, unfortunately you lost it somewhere.

Nope, we still have the cleanest cars and trucks, and best quality cleanest burning fuels.

Porsches. All the Speedsters are made here.


Canada and Mexico build our cars, they don't design them.

Thenagain cars ain´t our Forté.. Trucks are and (Cruise) Ships and (Sail)boats, Nautor´s Swan, Baltic Yachts and so on..

How much do they pollute?

Regarding EPA and the Gray market... just politics... just like the ban on importing powerboats from there to here nowadays.


Dirty cars are dirty cars

ACC it´s just not Your money that the 3rd world needs it´s also ours. So why aren´t we complaining, because we don´t invest there in the 3rd world that much, we like to keep the Jobs Right HERE and produce the products they need, not go there if possible.


PLEASE, everyone that has done cost/benefit analysis has shown that the US will by a long stretch be the one that pays for most of this debacle. What they want us to pay is probably a good portion of your entire GDP. And to add insult to injury, the nations that are doing the most emitting Like China and India are going to exempted :icon_bs:

Why is it that it takes 3 times more CO2 gases to produce the same Watt over there as it does over here?
Makes you rethink doesn´t it?

Because we understand that to have the greatest economy the world has ever known and to share that prosperity with most of the rest of the world we need to have massive amounts of energy at reasonable prices. Most of what Euro nations pay for fuel, electricity, etc. is because of massive taxes and regulatory fees from the government. And as we have proven time and time again (but you all won't listen) Government is best that governs least...:USA:

Oh, and as a side note- CO2 is not a pollutant :seeya:
 
Actually the fee is from using the sewers for rain ( grey) water right?
I guess it´s not illegal to let the water from the roofs still drain in the ground ?

The pay for that is hysterical though.

doesn't matter where the roof water drains to...even if it drains to the ground the theory is that it will run across the yard or parking lot until it eventually runs into a city sewer system drain....apparently that's what I'm paying for. I understand this may create a cost to the city...but $4K a year!!!

I have no idea what your taxes are in Finland but a corporation in the US pays 38% to the feds alone......by the time you add in State, City, Personal property, and all the other "fees" and taxes and I keep less than 1/2 of any profit made....If I don't make a profit at all I don't have to pay some of those taxes but other taxes as well as any "fees" must be paid anyway. The kicker, I have a few salesreps that have no responsiblilty for any of this yet based on the volume of sales they bring in, make more than I do. (not complaining, I need their services and they are paid accordingly)
 
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doesn't matter where the roof water drains to...even if it drains to the ground the theory is that it will run across the yard or parking lot until it eventually runs into a city sewer system drain....apparently that's what I'm paying for. I understand this may create a cost to the city...but $4K a year!!!

I have no idea what your taxes are in Finland but a corporation in the US pays 38% to the feds alone......by the time you add in State, City, Personal property, and all the other "fees" and taxes and I keep less than 1/2 of any profit made....If I don't make a profit at all I don't have to pay some of those taxes but other taxes as well as any "fees" must be paid anyway. The kicker, I have a few salesreps that have no responsiblilty for any of this yet based on the volume of sales they bring in, make more than I do. (not complaining, I need their services and they are paid accordingly)

The term is "differential runoff" the difference between what the ground would absorb in its natural state vs. an impervious surface (roof, paved areas, etc.) To avoid the charge look into draining the roof water into a cistern and use it for irrigation. Water from parking lots would need to have an oil and grease separater.
 
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