Question - how do we get boats under 30ft to participate in poker runs?

[baywatch]

I'm over 30' but I run with the slow group (because my boat is slow WOT 67ish with a cruise @ 50-60mph).

Generally, I think if the entrants know there will be other boats in their group they will come in droves. Nobody wants to run all by themselves and as a result if they think everybody in the run has an outerlimits they might just stay home.

I think if you get a few slower boats involved and then get the word out that there are runners in the slow group others would be happy to take part
( that $ price is a deal!!)

 

[blackhawk]

I think the term "poker run" intimidates a lot of people with smaller boats. Most people immediately visualize expensive big iron when they hear poker run and probably assume they wouldn't "fit in".

I can say that I think it's great that you are trying to get smaller boats involved and you're on the right track. Price is right too.

Maybe advertising a "fun run" for smaller boats would get their attention? Just a thought.

 

[Clayfan]

I'll agree with Alec, nobody wants to beat the crap out equipment anymore unless somebody else is paying for it.
That being said, and you have big enough water, I like to 55mph and slower boats leading and having the faster group go second.
Nothing like runing 45 to 55 mph and have somebody go by your port side at 80!
Everybody gets to the stops around the same time, everybody gets back for happy hour around the same time.
Just like on the motorcycles, their is safety in numbers, the larger your fleet and the closer you can keep an eye on both the slow and fast boats the safer your run will be.
I know some of the fast guys will disagree, but if your really fast and have to prove it, buy a lifeline and a helmet and go race.
Poker Runs are about "Fun, Fellowship and performance boating" there are no prizes for being first at all the card stops.. At least not at any of the runs I've been on.

 

[Perlmudder]

I think Phragle hit the nail on the head pretty well. From my own experience watching the WNY fun run, I can say that for the most part, I would feel out-done showing up there with my boat. Although my boat is nice, and clean, it is a family bowrider and not mean't for large poker runs. There is one poker run held every year by one of the boating clubs in my bay, and we do attend that. The run is only 25 or so miles, and for the most part we are the fastest boat at 55mph (on a good day). I can definitely say that at 21 years old, the poker run bug has caught me, and in the future I will be purchasing something bigger and faster.

 

[GENERAL LEE]

We never have them arriving anywhere 30 minutes apart.
Same time is our goal'

WHAT WE ARE SEEING is that the big guys arent wailing the pizz out of their stuff anymore.
Lot of our guys including me say Been There Done That

Our goal totally is Comraderie not First at the next stop.

I'm having same great day at 70mph as I was at 150mph.
Beer tastes exactly the same.

Good words :coolgleamA:

 

[Airpacker]

I'm having same great day at 70mph as I was at 150mph.
Beer tastes exactly the same.

IS that why you keep bugging me to finnish my boat ?


























Seriously, I have never had a plus 30 boat. I have run in I forget how many poker runs. Some once due to Biggus Dickus syndrome. Several many times because they are runs that are all about fun. Yes, we have run some very fast ( thanks Alec ) yes we have run some real slow ( my power play did 68 to the fire wall on a good day ). It is without a single doubt, the people who make or break a poker run to someone like me.

When I first started doing poker runs waaaaaaaaaay back in 1989, one of the first "boat people" that ever spoke to me was our dear departed friend and the god father of poker runs, Bob McCoy. Here's me, a young 20 something in a little boat parked beside some old guy in a 39 footer with 4 engines strapped to the back and he is actually talking to me. Cool.

Bob set the tone for me as to how I wanted to treat people at these runs and how I expected to be treated as well. Now 20 years later, I still feel the same way. I don't care what boat you have, how fast it goes or how fat or skinny your wallet is. If you're a good person, you're a good person who I could call a friend. If you're a complete wanker,well then, thats your problem. You won't make it in our club or circle of boating friends.

I ran poker run events for the Performance Boat Club of Canada for 10 years. I always did everything I could to make them "family friendly events".

Lots of folks in "normal" boats would come to those events with their friends and families as well as a lot of the "big hitters".
Everyone was made to feel comfortable and welcome. Wankers usually found themselves sitting in their boats alone at the end of the day while everyone else, big, small, slow, fast that showed respect and friendship to each other partied together.

As long as you can offer the smaller guys a decent course to run so they don't get beat up, show honest friendship and mutual respect regardless of what boat they run, offer true value for the entry fee and just be "good people", they will come and they will have fun.

 

[phragle]

as for the saftey aspect of the big guns coming up on the little guys not being safe, a poker run is not a closed course. a race course is. if you cannot safely navigate around a slower participant, or non involved pleasure boater on the same body of water, you are going to fast and operating your boat irresponsibly. There is no arguing that, there may be a floating log out there, there may be a 14 year old kid paddling along in a kayak..

 

[scarrab30]

I have a 30 foot boat , I do poker runs. the lake michigan runs are fun and some of the best video are of the 30 and smaller boats. I just fire up my two scott attwater 15hp mills and go for it. I ussually miss dinner but what the heck. I like the 30 foot boats in rough water cause you don't get bored.

 

[t500hps]

Jammin on the James has what your looking for (IMO).

Major sponsors were Active Thunder and Sunsation among non-boating companies....the manufacturer/owners absolutely love this run. Reggie himself came up to make the run and was probably shocked when his ego was put in it's place for trying to "take over" the event. We had his "cat killer" which was beat by a local 32 skater running 150ish. We have over adozen boats topping the 100 mph mark. We have a 21ft Chapparral and a 23-24 seafox fish boat. We have a couple 1980ish sub 30ft un-restored boats that make the run. None of this matters!!!!
The course is set so that we run to the bay/ocean but don't actually enter in it. We have prizes for farthest traveled (Indiana I think?), most festive crew, and the "Victoria Secrets" award among others. No mention is ever made (by the organizers) of the fastest boat, nicest boat, best looking, biggest or any other adjective that takes money to achieve.
The event is organized so that there are no surprises. 2 starts letting the faster boats go first (we considered slower first but cannot accept the potential safety issues). A great lunch stop with real food everyone can enjoy. A dock party that is second to none (ask ANYONE that attends, I'll take any bet you wanna make!), A band and sit down dinner that's great.
Everyone walks the docks and becomes an equal. WE only have "prime" slips for the first 50 entrants and it's first come-first serve PERIOD. Don't expect your $500,000 boat to get special treatment cause it's a nice boat, the guy who spent $20K probably spent a larger percentage of his annual income than you did for his ride!!!! The registration day has become a party of it's own with 41 boat with aprox 100 people entering that night. Like was already stated, the participants need to realize it's the people that make these things fun. It's surprising how many boats cruise at 50 or less just enjoying a boat ride for the day (I passed 4,000 rpm's only once as the helicopter dropped in beside me).

So basically, don't cater to the "big dogs". It may keep Jammin from being THE top run in the country, but Hot Boat Mag (before they closed) called Jammin one of the top 10 in the country!!!!

 

[Buoy]

Jammin on the James has what your looking for (IMO).

Major sponsors were Active Thunder and Sunsation among non-boating companies....the manufacturer/owners absolutely love this run. Reggie himself came up to make the run and was probably shocked when his ego was put in it's place for trying to "take over" the event. We had his "cat killer" which was beat by a local 32 skater running 150ish. We have over adozen boats topping the 100 mph mark. We have a 21ft Chapparral and a 23-24 seafox fish boat. We have a couple 1980ish sub 30ft un-restored boats that make the run. None of this matters!!!!
The course is set so that we run to the bay/ocean but don't actually enter in it. We have prizes for farthest traveled (Indiana I think?), most festive crew, and the "Victoria Secrets" award among others. No mention is ever made (by the organizers) of the fastest boat, nicest boat, best looking, biggest or any other adjective that takes money to achieve.
The event is organized so that there are no surprises. 2 starts letting the faster boats go first (we considered slower first but cannot accept the potential safety issues). A great lunch stop with real food everyone can enjoy. A dock party that is second to none (ask ANYONE that attends, I'll take any bet you wanna make!), A band and sit down dinner that's great.
Everyone walks the docks and becomes an equal. WE only have "prime" slips for the first 50 entrants and it's first come-first serve PERIOD. Don't expect your $500,000 boat to get special treatment cause it's a nice boat, the guy who spent $20K probably spent a larger percentage of his annual income than you did for his ride!!!! The registration day has become a party of it's own with 41 boat with aprox 100 people entering that night. Like was already stated, the participants need to realize it's the people that make these things fun. It's surprising how many boats cruise at 50 or less just enjoying a boat ride for the day (I passed 4,000 rpm's only once as the helicopter dropped in beside me).

So basically, don't cater to the "big dogs". It may keep Jammin from being THE top run in the country, but Hot Boat Mag (before they closed) called Jammin one of the top 10 in the country!!!!

Now, that sounds like a great run!!

Sounds very similar to the way the LEOPA guys have a run.
That is the type of run that I see attracting EVERYONE, not just the big guys.

 

[Buoy]

as for the saftey aspect of the big guns coming up on the little guys not being safe, a poker run is not a closed course. a race course is. if you cannot safely navigate around a slower participant, or non involved pleasure boater on the same body of water, you are going to fast and operating your boat irresponsibly. There is no arguing that, there may be a floating log out there, there may be a 14 year old kid paddling along in a kayak..

The only reason I brought that up, is that things can happen very quickly when you have a boat doing 120+ overtaking a boat doing ~60 - especially with a guy in his first few seasons, in either boat. It happens.
I won't disagree that if you cannot safely navigate your boat at the speed you are running, it is unsafe. But, instead of having unexpected "obstructions" such as a log or a kid in a kayak", let's also not create them by having a slower boat that is running the course by being out in front.

DaveP - I apologize if this is considered a Hi-Jack to what you were originally requesting info about in this thread.
The safety of the participants could very well be part of the reluctance of smaller boats to make the run, so I don't really see it as a Hi-Jack to the thread.
It sounds like you have a well planned run, and maybe that is a bit of information that you need to emphasize to get more of the smaller group involved.
My thoughts are only in an attempt to help grow the sport.

 

[DaveP]

DaveP - I apologize if this is considered a Hi-Jack to what you were originally requesting info about in this thread.
The safety of the participants could very well be part of the reluctance of smaller boats to make the run, so I don't really see it as a Hi-Jack to the thread.
It sounds like you have a well planned run, and maybe that is a bit of information that you need to emphasize to get more of the smaller group involved.
My thoughts are only in an attempt to help grow the sport.

Noooooooooooo problem! I appreciate everyone's input. I agree letting the slower boats first is a recipie for dissaster.

We have no awards (actually we will kick people out) for bragging about 1st to this , first to that...... We also require all boats to run with thier paceboats and NO ONE can leave a card stop until everyone has picked up their card.

I may tinker with the idea of putting together a "black jack" poker run. 32' and under and see what happens.

Thanks again to all for your input!

 

[FULL FORCE]

The bottom line here is that no one wants to be intimidated. I did my first poker run at the age of 22 with an under 30' 65mph boat and I didnt know a single person who was in it or involved with it. Going into it I wa scared ****less, a week before my boat broke and I was invited out of the blue by one of the locals to ride on his boat. I went and had the time of my life and met some people who evolved into lifelong friends. Once I realized it wasnt about the speed or money Ive tried to go back every year and poker runs turned into a passion. That being said, I've since then attended runs that I will never go back to becase of the level of arrogance in the air.

If you want to attract an slower 30' and under crowd you need to prove that your all about a good time and that anyone is welcome despite what boat they have. This is something that I try and stress on my fun run. When the owner of an old slow boat runs in the same event as American Muscle and at the end of the day says "fuk yeah what a great time, I fukin love it" then you know you did something right. .


The Cleveland East Side Boat Club opened up a world that I never knew existed, thanks to them I know have a permanet reminder inked on my back of what I really enjoy in life.

Very true, I have talked to Jeremy about that too, when I was next to him at the Casino, like he said... "we are at the same place doing the same thing"

I have ran my old slow 65 mph 320 in a couple local runs and have had a blast, funny thing is I can hang with more biggerfaster boats then I thought, a comination of have decent old resin bucket and the metality to run it like a offshore boat! You should see Tony give that 28 Cig a run!!

Only really bad part is AMII makes my Baja look SMALL!!

 

[GENERAL LEE]

Try to make the course for the 30ft & under group a more exciting, but shorter section to run. Obviously the fast boats are going to look for long straight sections to stretch their legs, but you could make the average speed boats run a different combination of stops, that would be more challenging than following the fast boats in a straight line all day.

I don't know the geography of your lake, so this may not even be possible. If you have some coves that smaller boats can safely run through, you could really make an aggressive course for them to run, that would give them something to talk about at the party that night, and none of the fast boats would even know about it. It would also encourage them to finish all 5+ stops, rather than ducking out after 1 or 2.

You need to somehow make it more competitive for the 30ft and under guys, beyond the cards. Those guys take big time out of their lives to get ready for a good poker run, so making part of the run directed soley at them would only make them more excited to participate, and bring friends. I guarantee you those guys might end up having the best time of all of the participants. You just have to make their portion of the run "special" or different to their style of boat, over the mega fast guys. As long as you can eliminate the perception that 30ft and under boats can't "compete" or enjoy a big poker run as much as the bigger boats, you've got it whipped. :coolgleamA:

 

[catastrophe]

See the picture above this post.

If you cant go past someone on that lake thats running at 60 you should quit boating.
And if for some reason you cant get past....DONT.

 

[Uncle Dave]

I just announced that we are sold out for this weekend's Roar At The Shore Poker Run - 40 boats which is great!

But - we only have 2 of the 40 boats under 30 feet.

We have a 60mph group for smaller / slower / or bigger boats that want to take it easy

The entry fee is $199 which includes 2 people for cont. breakfast, a killer BBQ for 2 at a Country Club which also will have a 2 hour top shelf open bar. And includes 2 poker hands.

So I think the value is there? I think the 60mph group helps accomodate?

Would like to hear some feedback from the under 30 boat owners as to how do we (NJPPC) get more smaller boats to participate?

Sounds like a great day and really good value.
I think you have that part nailed.

Tough one, in terms of getting to the 30 ft and unders, we definitely aren't comfortable with the big fast guys, and being last to all the stops just feels bad especially if you run at the head of your respective class. My 28 ft rig runs 90 - on a lake but in 4-6's you still get shat upon by the big guys instantly.

At the same time we cant expect coordinators to tailor runs for us so we usually just dont go. Our rigs no matter how cool and ridiculously powered for their size just dont get play in the large boat crowd.

Bracketed start times and modifed courses can offset varied arrival times, but it just feels a lot like you don't belong.

Naming conventions play a big part of feeling included- instead of a 60 MPH class its called a "Save your equipment class" this way you may get a bigger or boat or two to go along - lets not forget and that kind of sales job is always popular with a wife. Or call it a "cruising" class anything to eliminate the dreaded spectre of spending the money you did, and when you show up with your Gf and buddies you dont face the the shame of being part of the "slow" group.

I appreciate your reach out to guys like me.

In any case I wish I could make your run, sounds great!

UD

 

[2scoops]

I think it boils down to the attitude of the guys with the bigger boats. If the little guys pull into a slip next to a guy with a monster boat and an ego to match they probably wont have much fun. If on the other hand, The crew on the big boat is receptive to the little boat and willing to give a hand and have a word with them things would probably go much better. I don't think speed is of concern, If everyone is cool everyone has a much better time!

 

[Ratickle]

Advertise the run with a well-liked, bigger name guy (Offshore Racer?, Charlie, Rich), in a smaller boat (Banana, Pantera, ?) and you get to hang with him all day on a shorter/calmer course. You'll get a group.

 

[ROGUE]

I think water conditions play a part around here anyway. Saturday afternoon around sandusky and the islands you are going to get pounded in anything under 36'. Sure there are small smaller stout boats that you can run but they will be flying alot and falling into holes and the usual wives/GF's will be screaming bloody murder. Those of you have have run around here know what I am talking about.

 

[C_Spray]

No matter what, it is intimidating to park next to the big-dollar guys, even with a decent 38-footer. Having done a number of NJPPC events over the last decade, I can attest that they are doing everything right. While there is a significant amount of top-shelf hardware there, the club is very much socially-oriented. I have quite a few lifelong friends that I met on my very first NJPPC run.

As I have spent more time on the water, I've come to appreciate the basic concept of just being out on the water with friends as much or more than the concept of simply tearing around at maximum speed. I'm fortunate to be on Chesapeake Bay where there are tons of destinations. The best runs that I've been on are ones where everyone stops and gets off their boats to do something, like some of the CBPBA events. The biggest issue that NJPPC (and some other clubs) face is a shortage of destinations, but they can schedule raft-ups and beach parties into the runs.

NJPPC's "Chesapeake Rendezvous" is a step in a new direction, with the focus 100% on cruising (~60 mph max) and destinations. Because it's away from most members home waters, it's currently a multi-day deal, but the concept is there.

The concept of limiting boats to 32' or less is interesting, and might very well generate a huge turnout. There are certainly TONS of boats in this size range.

One thing about cruising at 60 rather than 120 is that your boating day lasts twice as long...