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socialized medicine
- Thread starter Bobcat
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Wrinkleface
Founding Member
:willy_nilly:
MattBMiller
New member
:ack2:
uke:pullmytrigger
Charter Member
yeah ok......and at what point do you get your heads out of your azzes?
a question - what would a top of the line healthcare package be worth for a year for one person with no "co pays"?
a question - what would a top of the line healthcare package be worth for a year for one person with no "co pays"?
2112
Founding Member / Contributor
Not the punishing rate of income redistribution you pay. The only ones feeling that it is a "great deal" are the "takers". You know, the guys that take way more out of the system that they put in.
Those of us who are the "payers", The guys who pay way more than they ever get out would be happier taking care of ourselves thank you. :cuss:
I am tired of paying the way for those who won't.
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Buoy
Founding Member
I got in a discussion this evening with a part-time employee.
He's a young college student. (22-24-ish)
He thinks that he should be entitled to Health care.
It is offered through his part-time employment, but, granted, it is expensive.
I asked him how important Health care is to him? He replied "Very important".
My question to him was then "why do you spend money on the new X-box games that you talk about everyday, instead of purchasing Health coverage"?:icon_bs: His only reply was "but, they take that out monthly"
Now, he's an OK worker, not setting the world on fire, but he's proficiently good, and will do what you ask him to do, but nothing more.
Now, I give the kid credit, he's going to school 12 credits, and working 20-25 hrs. But, I worked 45+, and carried 12-14 credits while living alone, making car payments, insurance payments, feeding myself, and not having parents to do my laundry, and clean my apartment - and I payed for it all myself (I had a little help with buying books).
I thought about this on my way home from work, and I think in some ways he's right, that students should be supported with some form of Health coverage. But, at the same time, to complain that you can't afford coverage, yet spend your money going out to the movies, or buying video games... I'm not seeing why you deserve coverage if your priorities are that F-ed up.
I went years with minimal coverage while I was self-employed - a good rule of thumb, when you don't have coverage, you don't get sick very often. Funny how that works.
He's a young college student. (22-24-ish)
He thinks that he should be entitled to Health care.
It is offered through his part-time employment, but, granted, it is expensive.
I asked him how important Health care is to him? He replied "Very important".
My question to him was then "why do you spend money on the new X-box games that you talk about everyday, instead of purchasing Health coverage"?:icon_bs: His only reply was "but, they take that out monthly"
Now, he's an OK worker, not setting the world on fire, but he's proficiently good, and will do what you ask him to do, but nothing more.
Now, I give the kid credit, he's going to school 12 credits, and working 20-25 hrs. But, I worked 45+, and carried 12-14 credits while living alone, making car payments, insurance payments, feeding myself, and not having parents to do my laundry, and clean my apartment - and I payed for it all myself (I had a little help with buying books).
I thought about this on my way home from work, and I think in some ways he's right, that students should be supported with some form of Health coverage. But, at the same time, to complain that you can't afford coverage, yet spend your money going out to the movies, or buying video games... I'm not seeing why you deserve coverage if your priorities are that F-ed up.
I went years with minimal coverage while I was self-employed - a good rule of thumb, when you don't have coverage, you don't get sick very often. Funny how that works.
pullmytrigger
Charter Member
Last edited:
LaughingCat
New member
Funny poster.
I am dismayed at home violently peole are opposed to changing our system when those same people think it's unpatriotic for the US to deny rebuilding Iraq, paying off the insurgents tso they don't attack and handing out money like breath mints to the populous.
I don't want socialized medicine here and we're not going to get it. We're going to get more options and better competition; huge features of a free market system. But the only thing that will break up the current oligoploy shared by the few medical insurance companies is government intervention.
But when our government is handing out my tax dollars by the pallett-load to the enemy, I think we can stop witht he cries of socialism over here.
So let's draw a line in the sand, either oppose 'socialized' medicine here AND scream for a withdraw from Iraq and Afghanistan OR allow some of the wasteful money we are dumping around the world to be dumped on us. Which is it, guys?
I am dismayed at home violently peole are opposed to changing our system when those same people think it's unpatriotic for the US to deny rebuilding Iraq, paying off the insurgents tso they don't attack and handing out money like breath mints to the populous.
I don't want socialized medicine here and we're not going to get it. We're going to get more options and better competition; huge features of a free market system. But the only thing that will break up the current oligoploy shared by the few medical insurance companies is government intervention.
But when our government is handing out my tax dollars by the pallett-load to the enemy, I think we can stop witht he cries of socialism over here.
So let's draw a line in the sand, either oppose 'socialized' medicine here AND scream for a withdraw from Iraq and Afghanistan OR allow some of the wasteful money we are dumping around the world to be dumped on us. Which is it, guys?
2112
Founding Member / Contributor
2112
Founding Member / Contributor
Both. I hate the war and socialized anything, even thought they are two separate issues.
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Ratickle
Founding Member / Super Moderator
I honestly believe you are wrong. Make it competitve. Obama only needs to push a couple of things right now.
1. Go save the 90 billion annually in waste and fraud. Use it for increases of those who are qualified for Medicaid. Medicaid is the current program for assisting those who cannot insure themselves. We do not need a new entity. It's a friggin smoke screen to take over 1/6th of the economy.
2. Make it ILLEGAL for a state to stop insurers from issueing health care policies in any state. If they are approved in Michigan, they can issue in Arkansas. Many states, depending on who pays the biggest bribes through campaign donations, will not allow insurers to issue policies when they can in the bordering states. Easy to do, easy to pass, easy to enforce, saves everyone money due to increased competition.
3. Tort reform. Estimates are as high as 80 billion per year in excess costs due to fraudulent lawsuits.
Those three simple things, everything is fixed. No new taxes, no new entities, no extra expenses. We are talking as high as $200 billion annually by some estimates. Even at half that, case solved.
2112
Founding Member / Contributor
In our state we are down to 4 insurers due the the state government mandating extras such as accupuncture and massage therapy be offered on all policies. Great move there.
And who is a one of the largest contributors to the democratic party?
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pullmytrigger
Charter Member
still 15g's for a family of 4......my taxes are about 12%......I own a business, the key is to have a good accountant and show as little income as possible......hey I made a comment about the pic above.....alot of people in the US see that and probably think that is what a hosp is like up here......feel free to go back to your rant
2112
Founding Member / Contributor
Funny, I have a colleague that practices in Surrey B.C., we pay ourselves about the same and his tax is closer to 60%. I am at 44% and I do everything I can to expense every nickel without getting in trouble with the IRS. I fully expect to see mine get up to 60%(+) when we become a full blown welfare state.
:icon_bs:
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03darkshadow
New member
i decided i would watch Obamas talk in minneapolis. if you look around the room, its either college age people or lower class citizens. hmmm.. he wants this new healthcare thing to not take away from those who have health care, but give an option for those who dont. what he isnt saying is that those who have it, will be paying not only for themselves but those who dont have it to get it through this "reform."
At least you're talking about cost reduction, nobody else is. The insurance companies were delighted at the thought of getting government to take the people they don't want. You should see how fast they run from states with anti cherry-picking rules.
This entire subject nationwide has, once again, degenerated into a health insurance/socialism argument. Nothing whatsoever to do with health care. I still say that all Americans should pay whatever they want for whatever plan or no plan that they desire, or do not want.
No GD fines for not buying anything, pay your bills as they come due. Period.
That's the Free Market, really. And get rid of the state departments and each state's control, there's the real kicker. Everyone should have the right to become members of the Free Markets.
If you see the current proposals in Congress now, they're what we have now with some consumer protections built in. Middle America, consider yourself lucky that nobody took McCain's plan seriously.
I like the nationwide concept, it will be fun to see the scamsters move in. I get great fax messages daily from them :icon_bs:
I don't see many people jumping up and down for joy over my no government, no fines, no mandatory anything free market approach to health care.
Offshoredrillin
New member
if you didnt have a good accountant and show/"lie" about your income, under the proposed legislation you would have to pay an 8% fine for not insuring your employees, it is still taking from the people that do and giving it to those that don't. the reason they are doing that is because of business owners like us, we cant hide payroll money, we can only "show" deflated income. by monitering payroll and reducing the profit, they will eventually catch up with it.
pullmytrigger
Charter Member
I dont have employee's its just me all the guys who do work for me are sub contractors and my guy is an ex Revenue Canada auditor that started up his own Accounting biz.....
Ratickle
Founding Member / Super Moderator
Unfortunately, you'd have to change the law to where you could turn away a person at your emergency room with no insurance, and that's not gonna happen.
It's just like the illegal alien, what hospital will turn them away for no insurance? None, so it doesn't matter what the bill says, or who is lieing, the truth is they have to be treated by law.
If we didn't have such morons for politicians, (read that as trained politicians/lawyers), this could be fixed almost immediately. Unfortunately, many government employees would lose their jobs, or have to become more efficient at what they do. It's absolutely moronic the way our government does things. And every fix I've seen to the high cost of healthcare coming out of these idiots is moronic also.
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