Agree. Some are handling the tough times better than others. My wife and son both drive Toyotas. I've had good luck at the local Ford/Toyota dealership with their service department. Personel has been steady, as well as the level of service, the past few years. No complaints there. Guess I need to trade the GMC in for a Ford. I came close earlier this summer. Hard decision to make though for a lifetime GM owner but GM is doing themselves no favors in terms of customer loyalty.
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GM 6.0L water pump
- Thread starter Knot 4 Me
- Start date
JupiterSunsation
New member
GM is right next to the a/c cannister about a foot off the firewall. The filter won't fit going up and out so it needs to go out through the fender. With the top plastic clip removed the fender cover bends down nicely and the filter comes right out. Once you have discovered the trick you can't believe it is that easy!
It takes 10 minutes tops including re-priming the pump.......
The filter will come out through the top. You just have to move the AC lines slightly and it will clear easily. At least that was the case on my '04.
Magic Medicine
New member
Not bad. Messy doing the Fords if you don't have it in the air or have the right tools!
Airpacker
New member
Maybe, maybe not. I have seen the mess some of those supposedly "trained techs" have left behind trying to beat book. The screws or bolts purposely left out because they are awkward and time consuming to thread back in. The cross threaded wheel nuts, stripped studs, warped rotors courtesy of the mighty impact gun. Head gaskets replaced without actually removing, cleaning and inspecting the head and block, just slide one out and slide one in, bolt her down and ship it.
I have seen some of those supposedly "trained techs" misdiagnose so many things its not funny. Some are very good at playing Diagnostic Darts. Some really suck at it and have to throw lots and lots of darts at the board.
Not saying they are all that way. I do know some good ones and a few really smart ones too. Heck, I even know a couple who know what a DSO is and how to use it.
Number one reason I gain new customers from the dealerships: "I am sick and tired of getting screwed."
Case in point. Monday morning I did a four wheel brake inspection on a 2007 Ford product for a new referral customer.
I informed the owner that there was nothing that needed to be done to her 37000km vehicle. Brakes were in excellent condition. 70% front pad material, good condition rotors, free calipers and slides. 50% material rear pads, slight corrosion build up on edge of rear rotors but clean faces. Free calipers and slides.
She questioned me about calipers being seized. I explained that I could move them by hand so they were definately NOT seized.
She then hands me an estimate from a large local dealer for 1300 worth of rear brake work deemed absolutely necessary by the inspecting "trained tech" due to seized calipers and worn out pads.
I used the old "Well mam, maybe someone in the office confused your work order with another one" line because I don't like openly slagging other shops for poor performance.
I billed her .5 for the inspection and I know for a fact that she will be a repeat customer.
Not to single out Ford here, I have seen very much the same scenario from GM, Chryco, Toyota, Subaru and a few indies lately.
Number two reason I gain new customers from the dealerships: "I have had the XXXX back to them 3 or 4 or 5 times and they still can't fix it".
Case 2 in point. I just ( less than one hour ago) got paid for fixing a Grand Cherokee that was at the dealer for two weeks and still drained the battery in a couple days. I guess they "trained techs" at whichever dealer the jeep was at couldn't possibly fathom that there might be more than one parasitic drain in the vehicle and that selling a BCM, a new battery and reman alternator should have fixed the guy right up. :rofl:
PS, I stand behing my work with a one year, 12,000 mile warranty on everything I do.
Been doing it that way for over 25 years and I have the repeat business to prove it
PSS, I have a degree in Automotive Technology and enough training certificates to wall paper a house. Classroom training only gets you so far. Learning by doing and reverse engineering gets you the rest of the way.
So, am I Bert or Ernie ?
Magic Medicine
New member
Which one do you want to be Bert or Ernie??? I am not going to take the time to read the long post, but you are an indy and I work at a dealer. There are some good and bad mechanics both places I think we can agree on that! Easy there big guy! Didn't mean to ruffle your feathers, you feel better now?:sifone::sifone:leaving::USA:
Airpacker
New member
I typed a longer retort but screw it. My skin is pretty thick after being in this business for ever. Please do use a narrower paint brush from now on
OK, I need to go groom my feathers. :26:
JupiterSunsation
New member
I heard the brake story at my local tire store for years (next time it is going to need brakes)......at 135K they got changed for the first time. Factory delco pads went back on and somewhere around 250-275K it will get done again.
Something that some customers don't realize at the dealerships: The service writer gets paid commission to sell services/parts you may or may not need...... People are stunned when you tell them that, like a light bulb goes off!
Mercedes dealer story:
07 GL diesel SUV- 10K miles in 90 days. Calls for a schedule A service ($400+). So I ask for a parts list, instead I get a 4 page list of what they "inspect." Inspect everything from tires, to battery fluid level (convienently under passenger front seat), seat belts, all glass right down to the windshield wipers. Total parts changed: oil and filter!
I decline and argue truck is 90 days old, change the oil and reset the dummy light on the dash......oh sir can't do that......manager is called in and she realizes that this service might be overkill for a 90 day old truck and ok'd the reset. Oil change was still $120 but more importantly the light got reset so I wouldn't be annoyed!
Drove it 50K miles in 22 months and traded it with nothing but 4 oil changes.
Something that some customers don't realize at the dealerships: The service writer gets paid commission to sell services/parts you may or may not need...... People are stunned when you tell them that, like a light bulb goes off!
Mercedes dealer story:
07 GL diesel SUV- 10K miles in 90 days. Calls for a schedule A service ($400+). So I ask for a parts list, instead I get a 4 page list of what they "inspect." Inspect everything from tires, to battery fluid level (convienently under passenger front seat), seat belts, all glass right down to the windshield wipers. Total parts changed: oil and filter!
I decline and argue truck is 90 days old, change the oil and reset the dummy light on the dash......oh sir can't do that......manager is called in and she realizes that this service might be overkill for a 90 day old truck and ok'd the reset. Oil change was still $120 but more importantly the light got reset so I wouldn't be annoyed!
Drove it 50K miles in 22 months and traded it with nothing but 4 oil changes.
Magic Medicine
New member
I typed a longer retort but screw it. My skin is pretty thick after being in this business for ever. Please do use a narrower paint brush from now on
OK, I need to go groom my feathers. :26:
:rofl::rofl::rofl:
Well put Sir well put!!!:sifone::26:
I see stuff like this all day, every day in my business. And there is a very disturbing trend right now, both at the Dealers and Bert and Ernie's. Since virtually all techs are paid flat rate and since business is off across the board, they are actually going beyond "excessive preventive maintenance" to downright thievery. We are seeing guys writing up non-existent failures and doing some of the old worn out tricks like spraying oil on a seal or shock and calling it bad. They are in survival mode and ethics and morals are out the window. I feel sorry for anyone bringing a car in to a shop they are not known in and trust because it is a bad time right now in the industry and these guys are doing whatever they can to keep the dollars coming in.
go4broke
New member
In my experience dealers don't send problem cars to independents, the independents send them to the dealer after shotgunning every related part onto the vehicle. Good independents are rare around here (I can only think of 3) . The best pay (unless its your own shop) is at the dealer. Where do you think the best techs wind up? Independents often quote a job cheaper, they are using cheap parts, making the same profit or more. Your dealer can get the same parts if you want them. I put an aftermarket fan clutch on my trailblazer, was faulty (rpm sensor) right out of the box. Reminded me why I always use OEM. It was twice the price, but works perfectly and will for another 100K. The brake job from the muffler shop is not the same as the one from the dealer, and not just the parts. Its a stupid simple job, but there are details to be attended to that are important, and are often missed or skipped for speed or just ignorance. Are there certain independents that are better than a particular dealer? Absolutely. But the most expertise on a car line will be found at the dealer. There are crooked people everywhere, going to one type of shop or another won't help you avoid them.
go4broke
New member
Sorry for the thread hijack Knot,
To answer your question, the water pump is very straight forward and easy, no special tools needed. The only "difficulty" is removing the clutch fan. As stated above, 99% of the time it's just the gaskets. Look carefully at where the coolant is leaking.
To answer your question, the water pump is very straight forward and easy, no special tools needed. The only "difficulty" is removing the clutch fan. As stated above, 99% of the time it's just the gaskets. Look carefully at where the coolant is leaking.
My 2006 came from the factory with electric fans so no clutch fan to deal with. I pinpointed the leak to the gasket where the pump bolts to the block on the passenger side. I'm going to put a new pump on anyway. I also now have to deal with a howling noise coming from the left front. Suspect a bad wheel bearing or possibly a bearing in the front diff. It is not a CV joint or ring and pinion noise. I love GM (General Malfunction)! :ack2:
Just turned 40K. Drained the front diff last night and the magnet looked like Dr. J's fro back in the 70's. Gear lube was bunrt and of course was low (thanks GM for being consistant in always underfilling your differentials). Probably a bad carrier bearing. The hits keep coming! :smash:
sweet addiction
New member
He beat me to it. That was the hard part. Everything else was easy. I had a 1999 model with the 6.0 in it. You can do it.
New pump is on. It was leaking out the weep hole. It was running along the underneath and then dripping off near the thermostat which made it appear to be a gasket leak. Gaskets were on their way out, though. Hope to get more than 40K out of the new one. Oh wait, I won't have this truck for 40K more miles!!!