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Warpath!
- Thread starter lucy
- Start date
Was that the race where Ben saved Bobby life?
DAREDEVIL
Banned
fund razor
Founding Member
Well, in one of my visits to Ben, he narrated the story and that is what he claims. There is a book call SEA-RAY, if you can get your hands on one, check it out, they tell the story well.
Also check out the John Crouse book, SEARACE, available from Charlie on the HORBA site.
lucy
Charter Member
Hey Daredevil Apache Performance Boat was used after they split up:blush5:
lucy
Charter Member
DAREDEVIL
Banned
lucy
Charter Member
Great Book everyone should have a copy!Also check out the John Crouse book, SEARACE, available from Charlie on the HORBA site.
Last edited:
Geronimo36
Charter Member
Here's a little excerpt from Bob a long time ago, I found it in the forums. NOTE: Bobby has said people have modified it to suite their needs over the years so I'm not positive if this is an original version but here ya go;
"I founded Apache Powerboats in 1978 when I started tooling my 21’, 33’ & 39’ boat line. I incorporated Apache Powerboats and went into production in 1980. At the same time I also owned and operated Race Headquarters, Inc., a custom Hi-Performance center and I also co-owned Hawk Marine Power.
In 1982, I brought the Kramer’s into Apache as my partners, sold my interest in Hawk Marine Power and absorbed Race Headquarters, its crew and all its equipment into Apache. The first order of business was to produce the baddest wave buster’s money could buy. Since the tooling for my new 39’ offshore was still months away from completion, I went to the King himself, Don Aronow, and made arrangements to purchase a new 41’ mold he had just completed. The first boat out of the mold was blue and tan and Benny called it “Warpath”. My original Race Headquarters crew rigged Warpath and off we went for sea trial. Ben and I ran Warpath offshore through some of the heaviest seas imaginable at over 90 miles per hour. Ben and I knew immediately that we had built a real winner. We entered Warpath in the APBA Open Class and won the Key West World Championship in 1984. The original factory team was Ben Kramer – Driver, Bob Saccenti – Throttles, and Tom Evans – Navigator. In 1985 we took Second in the Key West U.I.M. Worlds, with the red “Team Apache”.
Ben and I were now racing around the world with APBA & U.I.M. to promote Apache Powerboats. Because of our demanding race schedule we decided to contract Bobby Moore to rig all of our 41’ production and to serve as Crew Chief on our race team. In 1985, I ended my partnership with the Kramer’s on a friendly note agreeing to share the name Apache. I called my company Apache Performance Boats; he kept my original name, Apache Powerboats. Even though we were now two separate companies, we continued to act as one, sharing boat show space and tooling. We also continued to race as a team for promotion of the name. In 1986, we won the National Championship and were awarded the coveted US1 in our “prototype” catamaran “Team Apache”. That was also the year we introduced the new 47’ triple engine Apache Superboat.
In 1987, things started to fall apart. The Kramer’s had major legal problems and the government seized all their assets including Fort Apache Marina and Apache Powerboats. The government hand picked one of Ben’s employees to run the company while they completed their investigation. Some of Ben’s employees were involved with Ben’s problems, some left, and new people were hired. With the new star employee running things, the first order of his business was to disassemble the last 41’ Bobby Moore rigged and copy all measurements and systems and make jigs and templates to duplicate Bobby Moore’s genius. Bobby Moore has never gotten over this to this day.
Many years passed and it was business as usual for me. Around 1996, the government auctioned all the Kramer’s assets. The only thing they did not sell was the Florida Trademark for Apache and the Apache Powerboat name. I did not think about it at the time because my Apache Trademark, although slightly different, is a Federal Trademark. From time to time my attorney in Washington would inquire about the State trademark and was always told “it’s not for sale”. Well, SURPRISE – SURPRISE. After one such inquiry, I was advised that the same star employee had just purchased the Florida Trademark from the same “it’s not for sale” government for a couple hundred bucks. What a success story, the employee gets to own the company. Yeah.
Now the real confusion.
With Apache Powerboats & Apache Performance Boats already sharing the market, the old retired 41’ molds were purchased at auction for 12k and re-sold to a company in Ohio that advertised that they could build the “41’ Apache for half the price”. Also, the star employee moved to the other coast and started to produce boats by Xerox under another tribal name and when I wasn’t looking he slid a few Apache’s in for good measure. Personally, I think he should have named his company “High Dollar Lead Sleds, Inc.”. Additionally, in the early – mid 90’s, a Miami based company made a very, very bad copy of the 41’. They changed the bottom, cut the sheer, and the first time in the water the boat rolled in its first turn. The molds were stacked and stored in the sun and weather out in the yard to never be used again. Just recently those same molds were sold to an individual in Blountstown, Florida who is now saying he is the “New Apache”. What a joke. I wouldn’t use those molds for a flower pot.
All of this would have surely brought tears to Geronimo’s eyes.
Also, rumor has it that I sold out, died, left town, closed up and went out of business and so on. WRONG. NONE OF THE ABOVE
All that I have written here can easily be verified and I know, I lived it.
If you have any questions please call or fax me. I do better on the phone than the keyboard. The resin makes my fingers stick to the keys.
Also, thanks to all the Apache owners who put the TLC and money into keeping their Apache in tip top shape and promoting the heritage.
Best regards,
Bob Saccenti"
"I founded Apache Powerboats in 1978 when I started tooling my 21’, 33’ & 39’ boat line. I incorporated Apache Powerboats and went into production in 1980. At the same time I also owned and operated Race Headquarters, Inc., a custom Hi-Performance center and I also co-owned Hawk Marine Power.
In 1982, I brought the Kramer’s into Apache as my partners, sold my interest in Hawk Marine Power and absorbed Race Headquarters, its crew and all its equipment into Apache. The first order of business was to produce the baddest wave buster’s money could buy. Since the tooling for my new 39’ offshore was still months away from completion, I went to the King himself, Don Aronow, and made arrangements to purchase a new 41’ mold he had just completed. The first boat out of the mold was blue and tan and Benny called it “Warpath”. My original Race Headquarters crew rigged Warpath and off we went for sea trial. Ben and I ran Warpath offshore through some of the heaviest seas imaginable at over 90 miles per hour. Ben and I knew immediately that we had built a real winner. We entered Warpath in the APBA Open Class and won the Key West World Championship in 1984. The original factory team was Ben Kramer – Driver, Bob Saccenti – Throttles, and Tom Evans – Navigator. In 1985 we took Second in the Key West U.I.M. Worlds, with the red “Team Apache”.
Ben and I were now racing around the world with APBA & U.I.M. to promote Apache Powerboats. Because of our demanding race schedule we decided to contract Bobby Moore to rig all of our 41’ production and to serve as Crew Chief on our race team. In 1985, I ended my partnership with the Kramer’s on a friendly note agreeing to share the name Apache. I called my company Apache Performance Boats; he kept my original name, Apache Powerboats. Even though we were now two separate companies, we continued to act as one, sharing boat show space and tooling. We also continued to race as a team for promotion of the name. In 1986, we won the National Championship and were awarded the coveted US1 in our “prototype” catamaran “Team Apache”. That was also the year we introduced the new 47’ triple engine Apache Superboat.
In 1987, things started to fall apart. The Kramer’s had major legal problems and the government seized all their assets including Fort Apache Marina and Apache Powerboats. The government hand picked one of Ben’s employees to run the company while they completed their investigation. Some of Ben’s employees were involved with Ben’s problems, some left, and new people were hired. With the new star employee running things, the first order of his business was to disassemble the last 41’ Bobby Moore rigged and copy all measurements and systems and make jigs and templates to duplicate Bobby Moore’s genius. Bobby Moore has never gotten over this to this day.
Many years passed and it was business as usual for me. Around 1996, the government auctioned all the Kramer’s assets. The only thing they did not sell was the Florida Trademark for Apache and the Apache Powerboat name. I did not think about it at the time because my Apache Trademark, although slightly different, is a Federal Trademark. From time to time my attorney in Washington would inquire about the State trademark and was always told “it’s not for sale”. Well, SURPRISE – SURPRISE. After one such inquiry, I was advised that the same star employee had just purchased the Florida Trademark from the same “it’s not for sale” government for a couple hundred bucks. What a success story, the employee gets to own the company. Yeah.
Now the real confusion.
With Apache Powerboats & Apache Performance Boats already sharing the market, the old retired 41’ molds were purchased at auction for 12k and re-sold to a company in Ohio that advertised that they could build the “41’ Apache for half the price”. Also, the star employee moved to the other coast and started to produce boats by Xerox under another tribal name and when I wasn’t looking he slid a few Apache’s in for good measure. Personally, I think he should have named his company “High Dollar Lead Sleds, Inc.”. Additionally, in the early – mid 90’s, a Miami based company made a very, very bad copy of the 41’. They changed the bottom, cut the sheer, and the first time in the water the boat rolled in its first turn. The molds were stacked and stored in the sun and weather out in the yard to never be used again. Just recently those same molds were sold to an individual in Blountstown, Florida who is now saying he is the “New Apache”. What a joke. I wouldn’t use those molds for a flower pot.
All of this would have surely brought tears to Geronimo’s eyes.
Also, rumor has it that I sold out, died, left town, closed up and went out of business and so on. WRONG. NONE OF THE ABOVE
All that I have written here can easily be verified and I know, I lived it.
If you have any questions please call or fax me. I do better on the phone than the keyboard. The resin makes my fingers stick to the keys.
Also, thanks to all the Apache owners who put the TLC and money into keeping their Apache in tip top shape and promoting the heritage.
Best regards,
Bob Saccenti"
Apache was next door to FT Apache ...not sure where the other info came from. Bobby built larger than 28's in the BK BS deal
The accident was in the Apache Cat
Benny's son,btw, broke his arm in Gov't Cut in one of Bobby's 33' that Benn was driving...
Well, in one of my visits to Ben, he narrated the story and that is what he claims. There is a book call SEARACE if you can get your hands on one, check it out, they tell the story well.
Here is an article I found from the period about the accident http://fultonhistory.com/Process sm...er Oswego Palladium Sept-Oct 1986 - 0100.pdf
scroll a quarter of the way down on the right hand side.
Geronimo36
Charter Member
That is still a scary video to watch!
DAREDEVIL
Banned
Everything bigger then 28 was build in Hollywood FL !!!
"28's" yes but not after they split,,,until BK was gone .
DAREDEVIL
Banned
Where is that video ????
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