No you dont need a dictator, you need a leader! a Dictator will run everyone off, I believe we have seen this example, True born leader, who can demostrate the ability, to bring all together, yet still make sponsors happy, and make ALL teams the show. And the most important bring the show to the fans, so they want MORE!
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Let's try a different approach
- Thread starter T2x
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MOBILEMERCMAN
Founding Member / Competitor
So interested in pleasing the fan we have changed the sport. Is there any evidence the change has made it better? I see less boats, less competition, less pay out.
Ratickle
Founding Member / Super Moderator
I think it's an asy test to figure out.
Have a season where 8 or 10 races are close to shore for at least half their run, and the rest are the long runs offshore. The answer will come....
Phantom1
Charter Member
imco offshore
Competitor / Charter Member
there are just too many classes, and we are trying to accomodate all and that just wont work, me personally after all this stuff going on , i,m thinking of selling off everything and buying an old 38 cig,run one or two long races a year . i love racing , 10 12 races a year will kill a small business, too much time away." i think sean has the right idea "
MOBILEMERCMAN
Founding Member / Competitor
Here is an Old Key West Course from when it was truly a World competition.
I don't have a pic of the '01 course. It was similar , much like the storm course with the short leg. It was a great course.
All site cant accommodate a long course but, the ones that can most certainly should.
I course IMO Should be a minimum of 10 miles. If a boat won't run for 30 miles it is not an offshore race boat. Making shorter laps is a band aid to too few boats.
I don't have a pic of the '01 course. It was similar , much like the storm course with the short leg. It was a great course.
All site cant accommodate a long course but, the ones that can most certainly should.
I course IMO Should be a minimum of 10 miles. If a boat won't run for 30 miles it is not an offshore race boat. Making shorter laps is a band aid to too few boats.
Ratickle
Founding Member / Super Moderator
The current course is 6.5 miles about. From the pier I could see probably 3/4 of it. That makes it much more interesting for the fan side of me because I can watch the battles like was between Amsoil and Geico had last year against Popeyes and JBS.
I personally hate watching three boats go out of sight and only one emerging back into view 15 or 20 minutes later. What happened??????
Maybe we should actually start another thread in the dock for fan opinions of best races attended, and why....
I personally hate watching three boats go out of sight and only one emerging back into view 15 or 20 minutes later. What happened??????
Maybe we should actually start another thread in the dock for fan opinions of best races attended, and why....
MOBILEMERCMAN
Founding Member / Competitor
Paul you could pick a different place to watch. One could see the entire course from the Catamaran or the point on the rocks. Sorry no beer truck there though.
You can't see the whole course in many forms of racing.
You can't see the whole course in many forms of racing.
At the time, the KW course was changed for a couple of reasons, one being visibility, one was not a band-aid.
When questioning anything re: KW races, don't forget to factor in the conch and rainbow politics.
I am having trouble hitting the "submit reply" button.......but I will if it helps explain this particular question.......
Ratickle
Founding Member / Super Moderator
I was at he point on the rocks with Jay on Sunday, and with another group in 03. You can't see after you go past the point at the start of the seawall where that little right is. Then you see again when they come to about the start finish along the island.
I know. It's just that as soon as the race is over, I'm in the pits talking to the guys to see what happened etc.
Had the same issue at St Clair. Short course you can see the entire course, long course they go around the bend and disappear.
I'm strictly thinking along the lines of enticing more fans, therefore more $, therefore more teams.
One of the things which has to be taken into consideration, the attention span of potential fans. Now, unlike the old days, we compete against computer games, 100's of TV channels, quads, malls, etc. That has to be taken into consideration.
I believe the I Love Lucy show peaked at about a 68 rating in the 60's and the highest show last year was just over a 20 (American Idol).
OOps. Lucy was the 50's Gunsmoke and Beverly Hillbillies in the 60's. American Idol number 1 since it's inception.....
MOBILEMERCMAN
Founding Member / Competitor
Pat I used KW as an example ALL the Courses have gotten shorter while I have been racing.
My favorite Older Long Courses are. Corpus Christi, Sarasota, Key West, Pt Pleasant.
My favorite Older Long Courses are. Corpus Christi, Sarasota, Key West, Pt Pleasant.
MOBILEMERCMAN
Founding Member / Competitor
Paul, you can't see the inside turn from the mole either.. Sounds a little nit picky to me.
All I am saying is in the interest of making it easier to watch we have changed the boats to non offshore.
I can make an analogy to Nascar. No more road courses. "I cant see ". No more superspeedways. "I need binoculars and I have to wait from them to come around." We should just race short tracks like Martinsville.
Of course there are more differences than similarities, but the tracks make the events. Not the ease in spectating.
All I am saying is in the interest of making it easier to watch we have changed the boats to non offshore.
I can make an analogy to Nascar. No more road courses. "I cant see ". No more superspeedways. "I need binoculars and I have to wait from them to come around." We should just race short tracks like Martinsville.
Of course there are more differences than similarities, but the tracks make the events. Not the ease in spectating.
DAREDEVIL
Banned
Jim,,,,if u would be a sponsor of a team,,what did u want ,,the fans ( potensiol byuers of your product ) to see the boats ,,,,????? or your team just having a blast ??????
THATS THE POINT !!!
Just my 2 c.
BUT WHAT DO I KNOW ?!
I actually think the idea of Phantom 1 is cool,,,but i know how many would get lost counting when to head out .LOL
THATS THE POINT !!!
Just my 2 c.
BUT WHAT DO I KNOW ?!
I actually think the idea of Phantom 1 is cool,,,but i know how many would get lost counting when to head out .LOL
Sean Stinson
Founding Member/Contributor
Pete you are correct....but it has to be a leader that has the final say period and everyone has to be willing to play by these rules and stop with the fracturing of the sport!!!!!!!!:sifone::sifone:
MOBILEMERCMAN
Founding Member / Competitor
A minimum test of a race course could be. Can a STV out run the SVL's If they can it is not an Offshore race.
For those that don't know what a STV is it is brand of river racer/ drag boat with a model about 20', 500 lbs, 110+ mph boat.
For those that don't know what a STV is it is brand of river racer/ drag boat with a model about 20', 500 lbs, 110+ mph boat.
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Sean Stinson
Founding Member/Contributor
I agree Jimmy I dont understand why we cant run a sprint course and an endurance course where permissable....that would give you more racing action as well as the oppurtunity to show off your skills in various conditions!!!
Ratickle
Founding Member / Super Moderator
That's fair. Maybe on the inland courses there should big cruisers constantly parrelling the course at a distance....
Maybe that Bombadier 108' at 3/4 throttle.....
And there are some mean STV's out there......
Ratickle
Founding Member / Super Moderator
Since this is a thread to start from scratch the question to ask, and I know this won't be exactly correct, is:
What comes first and what is most important for growth from there?
NFL, very popular. AFL, WFL, IFL, gone.....Why???
North American Pro Soccer. Several attempts, all failures......Why???
Many more examples out there......
All had massive amounts of money thrown at them. All had TV contracts. All had so-called "stars". What went wrong?
Four things are important.
Fans
Money
Participants
Locations
Anything else?
And I believe you need all four, three won't succeed.
What comes first and what is most important for growth from there?
NFL, very popular. AFL, WFL, IFL, gone.....Why???
North American Pro Soccer. Several attempts, all failures......Why???
Many more examples out there......
All had massive amounts of money thrown at them. All had TV contracts. All had so-called "stars". What went wrong?
Four things are important.
Fans
Money
Participants
Locations
Anything else?
And I believe you need all four, three won't succeed.
DAREDEVIL
Banned
Absolutley!!!!!!!!!
Ratickle
Founding Member / Super Moderator
I'm not going to completely disagree. However, Martinsville is the toughest ticket to get and the road races have the least fan support and lowest TV ratings.
But, the root of you point, "we've changed it". may be something to think about. In my other example, the failure of every example that has disappeared, they were not the original offering.
Back to the basics ?????
(Now I sound like Rich..)
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