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Roll call from racers.

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TYPHOON

Charter Member / Competitor
I would like to hear from racers if they are willing to be suspended for a year if they get cought cheating? What I mean by cheating is a motor or drive infraction to what we all know what the rule book means by stock parts. NO GREY AREA! If it didnt come with the motor it is illegal period! Im talking about any part. Same plugs,wires,rockers, flywheels,coils,fuel injectors,pumps,manifolds,ECM,and block. There is more but you get my drift. Same on the drive with the cases,gears ect. :banghead:
MD
 
TYPHOON said:
I would like to hear from racers if they are willing to be suspended for a year if they get cought cheating? What I mean by cheating is a motor or drive infraction to what we all know what the rule book means by stock parts. NO GREY AREA! If it didnt come with the motor it is illegal period! Im talking about any part. Same plugs,wires,rockers, flywheels,coils,fuel injectors,pumps,manifolds,ECM,and block. There is more but you get my drift. Same on the drive with the cases,gears ect. :banghead:
MD
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YOU ARE ASKING THE WRONG PEOPLE THE RIGHT QUESTIONS.

Why did it take Smitty & OPA a week to announce the final St Clair results? Could it have been the lobbying,protests, & threats by the 4 team? Do leopards change their spots? You took the SBI trophy,well deserved, but do you think the 4 was docked points instead of being DQ'd was because Carbonell is a generous guy,willing to overlook a mistake? Have you asked anyone (Richie?) in Key West whether similar pressure was applied to overlook the 4's cheating and award them the trophy? It ain't always over when you think its over.
 
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Should be boat and owner since many team members have no idea what is in the boat they are in.

I could see this getting expensive and could really damage the sport. Let's say an owner is really pissed by how he has been treated and has deep pockets. What's to stop him from having every boat disassembled after every race. Tear it down to a bear block. You need to be careful of what you ask for.
 
Wahoo 214 said:
Should be boat and owner since many team members have no idea what is in the boat they are in.

I could see this getting expensive and could really damage the sport. Let's say an owner is really pissed by how he has been treated and has deep pockets. What's to stop him from having every boat disassembled after every race. Tear it down to a bear block. You need to be careful of what you ask for.
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SCCA Club Racing requires a bond be posted by the protester. If the protested item is found illegal, the bond is returned. If it is found legal the
guy that was protested gets the cash.
 
That's where deep pockets come in. The Guy protesting has them and the team with the motor in a bucket may not. Then he finds the machine shop shaved a .001 off somewhere they shouldn't have. You could have a class that is affordable become extremely unaffordable.
 
lucky devil said:
YOU ARE ASKING THE WRONG PEOPLE THE RIGHT QUESTIONS.

Why did it take Smitty & OPA a week to announce the final St Clair results? Could it have been the lobbying,protests, & threats by the 4 team? Do leopards change their spots? You took the SBI trophy,well deserved, but do you think the 4 was docked points instead of being DQ'd was because Carbonell is a generous guy,willing to overlook a mistake? Have you asked anyone (Richie?) in Key West whether similar pressure was applied to overlook the 4's cheating and award them the trophy? It ain't always over when you think its over.
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Not sure what happen at the OPA race i have no knowledge of that. You might want to talk to Smitty.

But you can rest assure JC and Richie werent preasured into doing anything. They had a conversation with Doc and told him that they would make a ruling on the situation. They met privately for about 2 hrs looking at rule book and their options . This was a little different situation because it was a 3 race Championship, I think if it was just one race he would of got DQ. Nothing was overlooked all factors were taken in to consideration and it was solely their decision.

Its was as simple as that no need to start rumors of what anyone said or was going to do because they didnt. They got caught and JC and Richie did what they thought was best no different if it was any other team.
 
Randy, that was the concept behind the sealed engine package. If the seals were in tact and with the right serial number you were good to go, no need to look inside. That program has two flaws.

1. Racers can't afford to send the engine back to Merc for rebuild/dyno certification every time something breaks inside.
2. Its been said that Mercury seals are easily bought. Not sure if they can match the serial numbers, but why not.

It's too hard to look inside and too expensive. We need a solution that allows teams to fix their own motors and keep partiy in the class. Shouldn't be too much longer.
 
Does anyone make seals that are better than what merc has?? The internals of a motor seem to be why we have seals. I realize merc has there seals for warranty and the average Joe cant play with them. Who makes a better seal? I dont buy into we should be able to work on our motors. I have never had to replace anything on my stock sealed Merc. motor. Thats 12 years of racing there product and I probualy have more races than most on my motors. I am willing to send my motor back to Merc if I need a rebuild or repair. Yes its way more money to do it but If that is what it takes to keep us all equal I am all in. I see no other way at this time.
For the record I will sign a document and put up a bond that says if you find anything on my boat illegal I will forfit my bond. I new the Pirates were on board as well. Anyone else?
MD :USA:
 
Jhas Industries make several types of tamper proof seals used mainly in the energy sector, but are perfect for an engine sealing application. The internal locking plunger can be barcoded or laser engraved. They are also available made with never recurring serial #'s. Any tampering with these seals will be noticed immediately. Look them up online if interested.
 
Racerguymiami said:
Jhas Industries make several types of tamper proof seals used mainly in the energy sector, but are perfect for an engine sealing application. The internal locking plunger can be barcoded or laser engraved. They are also available made with never recurring serial #'s. Any tampering with these seals will be noticed immediately. Look them up online if interested.
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I looked. Certainly a possibility for a org run sealing program.....
 
Wahoo 214 said:
That's where deep pockets come in. The Guy protesting has them and the team with the motor in a bucket may not. Then he finds the machine shop shaved a .001 off somewhere they shouldn't have. You could have a class that is affordable become extremely unaffordable.
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That is why I think you have to make the rules as simple as possible for the tech inspectors. And why I wondered how you police SV with the things which are allowed with an unsealed engine program.

But, as we know with past race boats sold into different orgs, sealed engines certainly can be, and most likely are, modified and resealed by those with no principles or ethics.....

Hate to play them in golf.......:eek:
 
TYPHOON said:
I would like to hear from racers if they are willing to be suspended for a year if they get cought cheating? What I mean by cheating is a motor or drive infraction to what we all know what the rule book means by stock parts. NO GREY AREA! If it didnt come with the motor it is illegal period! Im talking about any part. Same plugs,wires,rockers, flywheels,coils,fuel injectors,pumps,manifolds,ECM,and block. There is more but you get my drift. Same on the drive with the cases,gears ect. :banghead:
MD
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You might get some racers to buy into that idea, but I dont think you will be able to sell it to any of the Org.
 
Octane has no problem with this policy, we think the penalty should be extreme, if ya get caught, your out.
But I don't think simple mercury seals are the answer, testing and tech are needed on all motors, merc seals or not, too many ways around that, unfortunatly the only way to keep everyone honest now is to tech at EVERY race, too bad it had to come to this but it has. My two cents
 
I personally think a fine and points lost, If people want to cheat they will find a way,
they want wins and points championships, no points no Championship! and the fines need to be levied prior to the next race. caught a second time one year suspension,
3rd time life ban.
 
Point lost
and your suspended for one race season **

** Unless you donate (lets say) $1000.00 to a local kids charity of choice. After (and if) the money is donated contact the local news and tell them about "bad boys done good" and spin it into some positive press for the offshore community. Than your reinstated with points lost.
 
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I think points lost for that race and a stiff penalty,say $2500.00 and it must be paid to the next races purse and can not be won by the offender. BUT,where do you draw the line between cheating and creativity?
 
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