Pulled over by the police and searched for drugs - long but looking for opinions

[Chris]

When Judge Rhenquist wrote his majority opinion affirming the practice of DUI checkpoints, he paid particular emphasis to stating his opinion that the overwhelming public good brought by finding and removing drunk drivers from the highways outweighed the imposition being placed upon those being screened (paraphrasing- I could Google the exact text). I didn't write the law, but I'm somewhat familiar with it, as well as those other Supreme Court decisions that apply to traffic stops.

I don't agree with him and I know from the statistics compiled and the discussions with LEO's that they don't work and that they're rarely employed in a fashion that might make them effective. They do them around here at 8PM on friday in the downtown areas. If they did them a 2AM in areas where bar saturation was higher or by larger clubs, I'm sure they would be more effective- but they're not.

As far as this being a good traffic stop- the officers owed the individual no particular level of courtesy nor are they required to process the stop with any particular speed or efficiency. For all any of us knows, there may have been communication issues or dispatchers occupied with more urgent calls. The key here is the word "reasonable". There are no specific laws or rules written here. Many departments have guidelines that they expect theirt officers to adhere to so that if the issue of "reasonable" is questioned at trial, it can be defended and their charges against you protected.

X-rated- You may have missed that it would have been completely legal for the officer to arrest this young man, tow his vehicle and do an extensive inventory search simply on the expired plates issue. He could have spent the night and seen the judge in the nmorning about bail. I for one am glad we have officers out there keeping an eye out for all our safety. And writing a complaint is going to do absolutely nothing. If you were a citizen of the community and contacted the mayor or councilman you might get some lip service. But otherwise your opinion matters not. That's just reality.

 

[Never Enuff]

drew0982,
Next time you need a cop--maybe for a bad accident your involved in when your injuried and need assistance and he/she is the first on the scene and can perform first aid or if someone breaks into your house/vehicle and steals your stuff you might mention to him that you think "cops are a**holes." Especially if it's on Christmas or Thanksgiving while your enjoying yourself with your family and the cop is at work. I always loved to interact with people like you when I was working the streets:sifone:
Jay

 

[dwtinc]

Our finest at work

 

[Mark]

Bottom line is that the popo can do whatever they want and get away with it. I went through something similar when I was 20. The cops went through my car 7 times!!! They were the dirtiest cops I've ever come across and I learned a huge lesson which I've NEVER forgotten. It's a long story but I'll tell you they lied their asses off in court and held my personal property for over three months when it was supposed to be returned the next day.

I've sworn to create a "sting" operation on that department and others to expose their corruption; when the money is there. They were written up in the paper shortly after as the worst department in the state. Also, a friend who's brother worked for that department told me how his brother bragged about how they would "ruin peoples lives" when they were bored in the middle of the night. He had no knowledge as to my encounter. Needless to say, I keep the hell away from the long arm of the law.

 

[dwtinc]

I don't use the police services

 

[RollWithIt]

X-Rated, you must not have read all my responses through. But you are entitled to your opinion based upon the information that was stated here. We've agreed to dissagree on issues in the past and this is clearly another one. But to say that the Officers were clearly in the wrong and that it was a violation of Insanity's 4th amendment rights is a big stretch. And to know the "passive signal" by the K9 was it "sniffing" the car, well, you must have been there. While it is quite possible the handler missread the dog or the dog had a false hit, its far from a civil rights issue. It would be nice to have a video of the whole stop with audio, cause only then could any of us including yourself truely know what happened with no inherent bias either way. As for the going back to school thing, sure. I'll go. But not cause I need re-educated. Im sure I have a basid grasp of criminal law with a bachelors degree, time in the police academy and 11 years of experience not to mention numerouse career specific classes once on the job.

Mark, I will be the first to admit that there are some shady dirty cops out there. There are guys who get on this job and let the power go to their heads or they were crooked before even getting on the job and used the power to enhance their tendancies. Numerous departments have had this problem and it is a problem. I have no patience for people of this disposition and think they should be locked up. As for getting away with what ever we want, thats far from the truth. In the past it was alot easier but there is alot of oversight now. If something illegal occurs or a civil rights violation occurs at the hands of a LE officer, the side of the road is not the time to deal with it. Following up with the District Attorney's Office, State Police, FBI, etc.. is the proper way. Every year there is caselaw that comes out as a result of officers who do shady or illegal procedural actions to make a case. The only way that happens is when somebody who was wronged, stood up for what was right.

 

[dwtinc]

Every year there is caselaw that comes out as a result of officers who do shady or illegal procedural actions to make a case. The only way that happens is when somebody who was wronged, stood up for what was right.

I agree

 

[Mark]

X-Rated, you must not have read all my responses through. But you are entitled to your opinion based upon the information that was stated here. We've agreed to dissagree on issues in the past and this is clearly another one. But to say that the Officers were clearly in the wrong and that it was a violation of Insanity's 4th amendment rights is a big stretch. And to know the "passive signal" by the K9 was it "sniffing" the car, well, you must have been there. While it is quite possible the handler missread the dog or the dog had a false hit, its far from a civil rights issue. It would be nice to have a video of the whole stop with audio, cause only then could any of us including yourself truely know what happened with no inherent bias either way. As for the going back to school thing, sure. I'll go. But not cause I need re-educated. Im sure I have a basid grasp of criminal law with a bachelors degree, time in the police academy and 11 years of experience not to mention numerouse career specific classes once on the job.

Mark, I will be the first to admit that there are some shady dirty cops out there. There are guys who get on this job and let the power go to their heads or they were crooked before even getting on the job and used the power to enhance their tendancies. Numerous departments have had this problem and it is a problem. I have no patience for people of this disposition and think they should be locked up. As for getting away with what ever we want, thats far from the truth. In the past it was alot easier but there is alot of oversight now. If something illegal occurs or a civil rights violation occurs at the hands of a LE officer, the side of the road is not the time to deal with it. Following up with the District Attorney's Office, State Police, FBI, etc.. is the proper way. Every year there is caselaw that comes out as a result of officers who do shady or illegal procedural actions to make a case. The only way that happens is when somebody who was wronged, stood up for what was right.

Yes Roll. Can't blame an officer who is not corrupt being sick with the ones who are. I know several cops. The honest ones ***** about the guys who do it just to be punks on a power trip. Also, the best criminals I ever knew as a kid are now cops. Sad but true. That's oddly what makes them effective cops. I'd sure like to know what sheet they have done since signing up. Nothing would supprise me.

 

[Mark]

I don't use the police services

Agreed. I will use the EMS when and if the need arises. As for the rest; I own a lot of guns!

It's funny. Years ago, my Sister with her abusive husband with a knife to her 9 month pregnant head and tho popo right outside the door said "we can't go in there". Luckily she was not killed and the child is almost as fuked up as the Dad. Yep, they are there when you need them all right.

 

[fund razor]

Didn't the Supreme Court rule that protection was an unreasonable expectation of law enforcement agencies, and they exist primarily to deterr and investigate?

I thought that they did.

But if not... I am ok with being told that I need to go to school.

 

[RollWithIt]

Years ago, my Sister with her abusive husband with a knife to her 9 month pregnant head and tho popo right outside the door said "we can't go in there". Luckily she was not killed and the child is almost as fuked up as the Dad. Yep, they are there when you need them all right.

t

If that happened where i work, the door wouldve been taken off the hinges and the husband would need medically cleared before he went to jail..... But you would still find someone to say that they violated his rights and used excessive force..

 

[X-Rated30]

They pissed you off. They didn't beat you and plant evidence.

********************************************

X Rated has advised you.... maybe he will defend you if/when you take his advice.

LOL! Fund is right - you should just thank your lucky little stars these people who are supposedly protecting YOU didn't beat you or plant evidence - maybe we should give 'em a little gold star for it and ignore what they did wrong.

(And yes, If you asked, and if you could afford the fee, I would defend you. I made a decision a LOOOONG time ago, that I will defend anyone that needs my services and can afford my fee. Everyone is entitled to a defense in this country whether guilty, innocent, insane or any combination thereof. As for the fee, I am a firm believer in the Thirteenth Amendment.:sifone

When Judge Rhenquist wrote his majority opinion affirming the practice of DUI checkpoints, he paid particular emphasis to stating his opinion that the overwhelming public good brought by finding and removing drunk drivers from the highways outweighed the imposition being placed upon those being screened (paraphrasing- I could Google the exact text).

Ummmm, you said being in a vehicle is sufficient probable cause. This balancing test has nothing to do with probable cause, but the amount of intrusion into your privacy balanced with the public interest.

X-rated- You may have missed that it would have been completely legal for the officer to arrest this young man, tow his vehicle and do an extensive inventory search simply on the expired plates issue.

Ummmm, I don't think I did:

If he had the authority to arrest you and seize the vehicle, he could have offered you the option to be searched instead in order to obtain consent for the search, but that didn't happen.

And as for not filing the complaint, maybe you guys think the only reason to file a complaint is to get someone in trouble. Not true. If the complaint is handled properly and the officers made their mistakes by accident (and not in an attempt to circumvent the law), these guys' boss will see they need some training and they will get it. Then maybe the next time they search a vehicle, there won't be a built in acquittal if they find something.:ack2:

 

[jeff1000man]

Cops will be cops, and when they are sitting around bored, it just gets them to thinking about mischeivious ways to bust your balls until their shift is over.

I got pulled over on christmas eve a coule years ago on the way to my mothers house. It was cold about 40, and it was raining. I was going through a construction area. I was getting pon the freeway from the service road and got pulled over. I wasn't doing anything wrong and my tags etc. were good.

Officer asked me why I was driving on the wrong side of the road. My initial response was, "isn't this a one way street?" He told me that there was a report of someone driving on the wrong side of the street a couple miles from where I had come from. I asked, "what makes you thnk it was me?". He said "it was your license plate and vehicle description, matches the info that I have been given". He asked for my license and insureance which I gave him and then he asks how much I had to drink that night. I hadn't had anything, so I said nothing. He makes me get out of the car. I am wering a T-Shirt since I am in a heated car. It is 40 degrees and raining.

I ask the guy if this is really necessarysince he clearly has the wrong guy. ---Sidenote, Don't ever tell a cop that he is wrong, this just makes them want to be right even more---- I stand on the side of the road for 10 minutes taking the drunk test and saying my ABC's, then he wants to look in the truck. At this point who gives a chit, and I tell him that. Probably not my best answer, but he couldn't find anything, and these guys hate being wrong, so he searches my truck and finds my whisky stash. Luckily it is on the other side of the truck and under the back seat, out of arms reach, and I had all ready passed all of the roadside sobriety tests. He tells me to be careful on the way to my mothers and to have a nice night. With the random obvious choice words in the back of my head, I take back my license and get the fu(k out of there. But that is just one of my many bad experiences with these guys.

Keep in mind that I do not hate cops, I jsut hate this guy, and a couple others like him who are jackazzes. I would hate them anyway if they wern't cops. I am the first to go ahead and just sign the ticket when I get pulled over, because I figure it is payback for all the times I din't get caught.

 

[RollWithIt]

Jeff.. the situation you described is a bad stop and a clear violation of your rights as its described. First, if he had gotten a call about such a vehicle description, he could have easily had the dispatcher rebroadcast the info over the radio with you listening, ive done this on numerous occassions when something thinks Im just randomly stopping them for nothing. It goes along way in proving credibility. Second, he had no legal right to remove you from the car and perform field sobriety tests. The reasonable suspicion that he would need is the typical glassy bloodshot eyes, slurred or slow speach, an odor of an alcoholic-brewed beverage emminating from your person and impaired movements. Without these, you can not take a driver from a vehicle if they have a good license and the vehicle is valid. Why guys do stupid stuff like this amazes me cause they open themselves up for lawsuits and rightfully should be sued.

 

[Madpoodle]

There's right... and then there's "right but pushing it is wrong."

Frankly.... right or wrong I would be quite reluctant to draw further attention to myself in that small town. IMO... it was a case of "driving while not from around here." A wise man would be tempted to be very inconspicous for the remainder of your time there. They pissed you off. They didn't beat you and plant evidence.
However, perhaps you have a touch of crusader or reformer in you....

If you enjoyed that stop, you will love the next. Go make a federal case out of it. You can be the Rosa Parks of small town Ohio bad traffic stops.

X Rated has advised you.... maybe he will defend you if/when you take his advice. In fact.... you may want to take him with you when you go file your complaint. Have him drive his rental car.

When I was 22 I would have filed charges against them. At 42, I would have counted my fingers and toes, gone home, poured a drink, and thanked God that I am not a miserable small town cop, and that I don't HAVE to see them again.

Bingo..

 

[Never Enuff]

Jeff,
I totally agree with rollwithit. When officers(a small%) abuse their authority and violate citizen rights they have cast a shadow on the thousands and thousands that do a good job everyday. They are also partly responsible for stories such as the ones you have read on this thread. Everyone has a "cops did this to me" story. Some are true and have not been "enhanced", others I wonder what the other half of the story is????? If you really want to know what the cops do, most departments have a ride along program. Try riding with an officer for an 8 or 10 hour shift and see for yourself then make a judgement on what kind of job they do. I think you will be suprised. The alternative is to sit here behind your computer and say things like " all cops are a**holes."
Jay